(00:38:26)(SockDog)gg's all. Oh it's only 22:30 was such good games it felt like it was going to be 1am or something. :)
(00:38:27)(stealth6)Games are still going
(00:38:37)(stealth6)lol
(00:38:49)(stealth6)6 spots left for anybody who's interested
(00:40:06)(senethro)I actually had fun in tonights game
(00:40:17)(senethro)was just too muddled to work out what was going on last time
(00:40:33)(senethro)and without wanting to be a shithead about it, it was more fun than I had with Brink :/
(00:45:07)(Locki)s'ok
(00:45:34)(Locki)it's definitely more the spiritual successor to our dedicated PC titles - such as Wolf ET
(00:48:22)(stealth6)It's going in the right direction, tonights games were fun
(00:48:28)(stealth6)(cause I won)
(00:48:55)(SockDog)senethro: There is a period of confusion. SD needs to work on that as I think it can really turn people away.
(00:49:10)(SockDog)And I mean more than just the UI
(00:49:35)(stealth6)I think when they release the story and some gameplay vids it will be good
(00:49:45)(SockDog)Not sure about everyone else but the Brink Challenges and the topic in the forum were we have a survival mode with objectives to complete (co-op) might help
(00:49:47)(stealth6)gamers aren't the hardest people to convince
(00:50:12)(SockDog)Many gamers are lazy and want things handed to them
(00:50:26)(SockDog)I had to force myself to watch the NS2 vids
(00:50:42)(SockDog)I was like, holy shit, this is going to be boring, I load a game to watch a video
(00:51:02)(SockDog)In my defense I'm a heavy learn through doing kind of person though
(00:51:14)(SockDog)by heavy I mean fat. :)
(00:51:22)(SockDog)hahahaha /me eats doughnut
(00:51:28)(SockDog)crush you all
(00:51:42) SockDog back to forum bitching.
(00:52:02)(Locki)did the London Bridge tutorial video work for you guys?
(00:52:23)(SockDog)Oh, wait. Everyone post in the Reasons for Locki to smack down on the rest of SD and include modding thread!
(00:52:33)  quit: (senethro) (webchat@16.106.113.87.dyn.plus.net) (Ping timeout)
(00:52:36)(SockDog)http://forums.warchestgames.com/showthread.php/33349-The-case-for-mod-map-support-Let-s-convince-SD-why-it-s-a-good-business-decision
(00:52:42)(malarky)SockDog, :)
(00:52:55)(DarkangelUK)Tonights games were good, the only thing that got to me was the slow down when getting shot
(00:53:01)(SockDog)Locki: It gave a taste but in the heat there is so much going on.
(00:53:05)(DarkangelUK)never really bothered me before, but tonight it did for some reason
(00:53:21)(SockDog)Locki: As someone that doesn't swim well it does feel like being thrown in a pool.
(00:53:32)(DarkangelUK)I also think the defence spawn is too close to the chapel in Whitechapel
(00:53:39)(SockDog)Locki: And then someone saying, but you watched the video on swimming didn't you?
(00:54:22)(SockDog)Locki: Once you get it, you get it. And everything becomes clear. But you really do have a thrown in pool moment for all your players, even us experienced ones.
(00:54:31) SockDog takes breath
(00:54:37)(SockDog)actually I need a piss
(00:54:39)(SockDog)brbr
(00:56:32)(SockDog)hahaha one more br and who would have turned up
(00:57:12)(DarkangelUK)its like saying bloody mary 5 times in the mirror... say brbrbr 5 times in IRC and it appears
(00:58:11)(Pytox_)yea stealth6 that's because you have me on the team lol
(00:59:33)(stealth6)We Belgians can't be beat
(00:59:39)(Pytox_):p
(00:59:42)(cause|Rex)omg people ask stupid questions already
(00:59:50)(cause|Rex)"2. Is VOIP going to be turned ON by default?"
(00:59:56)(cause|Rex)cares very much!
(01:00:12)(cause|Rex)"Which Unreal Engine are we looking at here?"
(01:00:14)(cause|Rex)unreal 5
(01:00:17)(Pytox_)3
(01:00:27)(cause|Rex)5
(01:00:54)(Pytox_)it's 3 lol
(01:00:59)(Pytox_)4 will come out for next gen
(01:01:00)(cause|Rex)no 5 lol
(01:01:10)(cause|Rex)yes and 5 for PS5
(01:01:32)(Pytox_):p
(01:01:40)(stealth6)meh I don't really care for voip ingame it's never really done right
(01:01:40)(cause|Rex)ohh dear pytox please...
(01:01:44)(stealth6)I just use 3rd party
(01:01:47)(cause|Rex)time to troll a bit...
(01:02:13)(stealth6)would be cool if the game has support for 3rd party ingame layover stuff (so you can see who's talking on ts for example)
(01:02:37)(SockDog)Put VOIP on.
(01:03:04)(SockDog)Make it obvious to turn off
(01:03:12)(cause|Rex)ähhm stealth
(01:03:21)(cause|Rex)impossible to do
(01:03:41)(SockDog)?
(01:04:29)(DarkangelUK)im guessing he means team voip, not global or AOR
(01:05:46)(Pytox_)lawl on the youtube video Ummm... why does their key﻿ visual look like a cross between a Radioactive symbol and a friggin' Neo Nazi Swastika?!
(01:06:00)(Pytox_)like wth :p
(01:06:20)(SockDog)ETQW was nice with Voip IIRC. Just needed easy way to mute people.
(01:06:54)(Sean)ET:QW makes me melt
(01:07:08)(SockDog)Really don't agree with babying and sheltering some players because people are dicks. That ruins a level of the game for many others.
(01:07:59)(SockDog)By all means give people tools to permablock, tempblock people or if they want disable (with visual indicator to the rest of team).
(01:08:26)(SockDog)I used to think, bah, use teamspeak pussies. But that's not great for pub games.
(01:08:35)(DarkangelUK)Cod (yes! I said it!) when you mute someone keeps them muted forever unless you unmute
(01:08:51)(SockDog)That should be in there.
(01:09:04)(DarkangelUK)it also has a 'mute all' function
(01:09:14)(SockDog)Worst thing about online isn't the dicks, it's being unable to filter them out.
(01:09:20)(cause|Rex)pub clans only know ingame voip
(01:09:31)(SockDog)and?
(01:09:49)(cause|Rex)so they won't find TS
(01:09:58)(murka^L2)i think i remember a bind somewhere that looked like voip
(01:10:10)(murka^L2)so it seems they're working on it
(01:10:30)(SockDog)TS isn't voodoo. Maybe they just don't feel the need to spend money on a TS server when in game VOIP is enough to have fun in pub games.
(01:10:59)(murka^L2)tho voip in etqw did have decent latency
(01:11:16)(murka^L2)best notced when someone had open mic
(01:11:23)(murka^L2)lika second of lag
(01:11:43)(SockDog)I remember VOIP in ETQW as being nice. Separate buttons for who you was talking to.
(01:12:02)(SockDog)Of course SD could just also offer to host TS servers. :)
(01:12:05)(SockDog)for a price.
(01:12:09)(SockDog)and a kidney
(01:13:46)(SockDog)Kind of weird that a lot of the content on SD forums for DB is from new users.
(01:14:25)(DarkangelUK)lurkers wanting their name and punting a comment in since they've registered
(01:15:21)(cause|Rex)where do all those people come from?
(01:15:40)(cause|Rex)seems a bit like brink players too me
(01:15:44)(DarkangelUK)was posted in RPS, Eurogamer, Joystiq etc
(01:15:46)(SockDog)Some of the questions are valid though.
(01:15:54)(murka^PC)i wonder if going back to 3.8ghz and tightening memory timings will give better performance
(01:16:03)(SockDog)I'd maybe like a steam overlay in the game
(01:16:20)(DarkangelUK)could always launch as non-steam game
(01:16:29)(Pytox_)maybe steam will have voip soon too who knows :p
(01:16:34)(Pytox_)but decent voip
(01:16:47)(Pytox_)the one in steam chat never seems to work for me though
(01:16:54)(DarkangelUK)I use it almost daily
(01:16:56)(DarkangelUK)works fine
(01:17:09)(DarkangelUK)easy to add new users
(01:17:11)(Pytox_)well at least doesn't work well when l4d2 open with mic or so :p
(01:17:21)  quit: (murka^PC) (~nnscript@murka.users.quakenet.org) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
(01:18:17)(DarkangelUK)only annoyance was one game, cant remember, had ingame voip also going at the same time... heard ourselves twice
(01:18:36)(DarkangelUK)another disabled steam voip so it could use ingame
(01:18:41)(Pytox_)yea
(01:19:35)(SockDog)VOIP in L4D works fine but I've found that it's a bit more flaky in chat
(01:20:04)(SockDog)True about the 3rd party game but it's always nice to track the hours too.
(01:20:07)(DarkangelUK)we just create a multi-user chat in steam and start voip there... usually skip ingame vouip
(01:20:27)(SockDog)I've found that dropping users sometimes.
(01:20:40)(SockDog)although I've not used it a huge amount
(01:22:29)(SockDog)This is my bloody virgin router. 20-30seconds of 1ms and then this.
(01:22:34)(Locki)An odd thought to leave you all with before I go to bed. Is MP like sport? For ten years we've made MP games, and we've never had the overwhelming support _or_ apathy that SP games can get, but our games (existing or announced) seem to provoke such STRONG reactions in people.
(01:22:36)(SockDog)Reply from 192.168.66.6: bytes=32 time<1ms TTL=64
(01:22:37)(SockDog)Reply from 192.168.66.6: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=64
(01:22:37)(SockDog)Reply from 192.168.66.6: bytes=32 time=170ms TTL=64
(01:22:37)(SockDog)Reply from 192.168.66.6: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=64
(01:22:37)(SockDog)Reply from 192.168.66.6: bytes=32 time=182ms TTL=64
(01:22:38)(SockDog)Reply from 192.168.66.6: bytes=32 time<1ms TTL=64
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(01:23:39)(SockDog)I'd consider it a sport although others would argue the definition.
(01:23:41)(Pytox_)Well yea it's kinda like sport
(01:23:50)(Pytox_)especially with the _te maps :D
(01:23:53)(@Anti-)definitely a sport
(01:23:54)(SockDog)What I think is the issue is making it accessible for spectators
(01:24:02)(@Anti-)we're bread to compete, survival instinct
(01:24:08)(@Anti-)games and sports are the practice of that
(01:24:10)(Pytox_)I like pwning cause|Rex
(01:24:15)(Pytox_);D
(01:24:27)(SockDog)Is it fun to watch. can people engage through only watching.
(01:24:46)(cause|Rex)had some good esport times in the past, so definitely yes
(01:24:51)(@Anti-)I could with The International 2
(01:24:52)(@mitsuhiko)o hai
(01:24:55)(@Anti-)even at 4am :D
(01:24:57)(stealth6)games are worse than sport
(01:25:10)(SockDog)Hai!
(01:25:17)(Pytox_)hai
(01:25:29)(Sean)Locki, dare I say that SP games have a captivating story which MP games don't. Hence the overwhelming support from communities and players who loved the original games.
(01:25:31)(stealth6)you can say whatever you want and get away with it so reactions can get out of hand easily
(01:25:31)(SockDog)You need to get people watching though. right now we're in our bedrooms playing.
(01:25:45)(Pytox_)It would be cool to have some kind of things where you can view multiple matches on one screen :D
(01:25:55)(Sean)Pytox_, press the red button
(01:25:59)(Locki)We're going to do a gameplay trailer in a week or two...
(01:26:04)(Pytox_)cool
(01:26:10)(Pytox_)can I be in it? :P lol
(01:26:26)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: i like your thread ;)
(01:26:27)(SockDog)I think they were doing it yesterday
(01:26:30)(stealth6)which means gameplay is almost ready
(01:26:58)(@Anti-)MLG has multieview :)
(01:27:01)(stealth6)aka no faster movement, no strafe no crouch jumo, no, no, no
(01:27:02)(SockDog)mitsuhiko: I hope people bloody post to it otherwise I'm taking my arms off and throwing them in the air.... wait.
(01:27:04)(Pytox_)you should record when datacores get stollen very quick
(01:27:12)(Pytox_)*stolen
(01:27:30)(stealth6)they are recording all the time afaik
(01:27:32)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: i think i am not in the position of where i could partake in that thread so i am afraid you might have to fight for more participation by yourself :)
(01:27:35)(Locki)I'm pretty comfortable with the base three maps and the initial five classes that I'd call them beta, but not the feature set (campaign mode, spectator, clan and tournament support, dedicated server solution etc)
(01:27:54)(SockDog)Anti-: I think it's more than viewing. There needs to be a way to relate whats happening rather than frag frag frag frag plant.
(01:28:02)(@mitsuhiko)Locki: just call it alpha and roll wiht it
(01:28:14)(@mitsuhiko)it's the year of kickstarter where people sell stuff that does not even exist yet
(01:28:18)(cause|Rex)be careful with showing of the gameplay too early!
(01:28:20)(Pytox_)There was this w:et mod that did some cool viewing features
(01:28:22)(@Anti-)yes, first person is a real burden to that
(01:28:25)(@Anti-)MOBA so it so well
(01:28:27)(Pytox_)some special cam stuff don't what the name was :p
(01:28:28)(@Anti-)and RTS
(01:28:28)(@mitsuhiko).oO( somethign about kickstarter being presales )
(01:28:31)(SockDog)mitsuhiko: Yes, I'm gonna guilt these mofos. :)
(01:28:33)(@Anti-)there are some solutions though
(01:28:51)(SockDog)I would kickstart the nuts of DB. :)
(01:28:56)(SockDog)off
(01:29:18)(cause|Rex)I discourage you from showing off the gameplay we got atm
(01:29:25)(Pytox_)does kickstarter have paypal
(01:29:29)(SockDog)Anti-: I think if someone can make FPS presentable and commentator friendly then it would grow as a sport.
(01:29:34)(stealth6)Pytox camtrace?
(01:29:39)(Pytox_)idk could be :p
(01:29:53)(SockDog)probably buckets of money too, that always helps. money and boobies. and drink.
(01:30:03)(Locki)whys that rex?
(01:30:09)(stealth6)what's so good about MOBA?
(01:30:12)(Pytox_)no was something else stealth6
(01:30:22)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: severity of decisions
(01:30:26)(cause|Rex)well have you read some opinions to your teaser?
(01:30:43)(@Anti-)a lot is dependant on game mode too SockDog, really not sure how much SW can suit it, but have plenty of ideas how you could improve FPSs in general
(01:30:51)(cause|Rex)people want a different movement + fights
(01:30:55)(@Anti-)for spec that is
(01:31:00)(Locki)I think I've read ALL the opinions of the teaser :)
(01:31:04)(@Anti-)and gameplay but meh, whole other story :D
(01:31:21)(cause|Rex)people are afraid it will be more like Brink like
(01:31:39)(cause|Rex)also when I talked to my mates today, they had the same feeling
(01:31:47)(SockDog)Anti-: Yup that's true. I mean football is a pretty basic game, some FPS is way more complicated because it probably has less physical skill to rely on.
(01:31:55)(Locki)Well, the gameplay is not at all like BRINK though?
(01:32:04)(cause|Rex)but the movement!
(01:32:06)(Pytox_)there is no sliding
(01:32:12)(Locki)(but I agree, their fears must be countered)
(01:32:13)(cause|Rex)just without smart
(01:32:15)(SockDog)cause|Rex: From what I've read people think it looks like brink.
(01:32:20)(cause|Rex)yes
(01:32:25)(Locki)one mo
(01:32:26)(SockDog)A gameplay video will dispell that
(01:32:31)(cause|Rex)my mates first reaction was: this looks like brink
(01:32:34)(Locki)Do you mean people _want_ BRINK movement?
(01:32:35)(@mitsuhiko)i expected so much worse, was pleasently surprised today
(01:32:40)(cause|Rex)no!
(01:32:43)(SockDog)There is hardly any gameplay in the teaser.
(01:32:48)(cause|Rex)people want ET or QW movement
(01:32:54)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: that's why i was pleasently surprised :)
(01:33:01)(@mitsuhiko)nobody has any ideas yet, so generic feedback
(01:33:07)(Locki)ok
(01:33:10)(Pytox_)people want CoD movement :trollface: :p
(01:33:11)(@mitsuhiko)but the few hints were enough to make *some* people interested
(01:33:21)(Locki)but db doesn't have BRINK movement?
(01:33:24)(cause|Rex)I could start a new thread if the major wishes aren't clear yet
(01:33:28)(Locki)(on purpose by the way!)
(01:33:28)(SockDog)Yes, you can't read into feedback what you didn't present in the teaser
(01:33:35)(stealth6)Pytox uv movie mod?
(01:33:55)(Locki)this chat client is a stinking pile of poo
(01:34:20)(stealth6)no autoscroll?
(01:34:22)(SockDog)KVIrc
(01:34:25)(Pytox_)i don't like the web chat too :(
(01:34:29)(@Anti-)SockDog: What RTS and MOBA have that FPS doesn't, that makes them so watchable, is the fact you never miss the best bits due to point of view
(01:34:32)(@mitsuhiko)Locki: get xchat wdk
(01:34:40)(@mitsuhiko)http://www.hexchat.org/
(01:34:49)(cause|Rex)also the fights are more like, who shoots first wins
(01:34:50)(@Anti-)and the games have downtime between big fights, to build the narrative and tension
(01:34:56)(Pytox_)stealth6: idk anymore :p
(01:34:59)(SockDog)KVIrc better than xchat IMO. :)
(01:35:10)(Pytox_)cause|Rex: not when you have turrets nearby :)
(01:35:14)(Locki)Lemme put this another way... If the gameplay movie makes it clear that we've created a dedicated PC title, as a spiritual successor to Wolf ET (not BRINK), but evolved for the decade that's passed since, wouldn't those 17.5 million people that played Wolf ET, but not BRINK, be happy?
(01:35:16)(cause|Rex)XD
(01:35:23)(cause|Rex)put the jokes aside pytox
(01:35:35)(SockDog)Anti-: Yes. But does that mean you guys need to work on a more entertaining 3rd person?
(01:35:50)(@Anti-)to some extent yes
(01:35:57)(@Anti-)but also better ways to see the best bits
(01:36:03)(@Anti-)in first person
(01:36:36)(SockDog)A waste perhaps for the actual people playing but for spectators, very good animation, models, effects etc would go a long way to what is regularly people sliding around and exploding randomly. :)
(01:36:38)(Pytox_)yea in tps it's like wth is happening
(01:36:55)(Locki)I think the game's position is critical - BRINK was slow movement and low lethality. DB is faster movement and high lethality.
(01:36:59)(cause|Rex)yes Locki they want to see their old gameplay
(01:37:20)(SockDog)Well I think if you have a server demo that is at least a start. Perhaps from there you could render the data in a different client more suited to recording and presenting the action.
(01:37:27)(Locki)I think this may be the fastest we can get and it feel right
(01:37:27)(Pytox_)yea more like w:et or quake3
(01:37:32)(@Anti-)I think ultimately a lot wont be happy till they see the first person action
(01:37:43)(Locki)we have server demo :)
(01:37:58)(Locki)we have some cool stuff to show you - super cool in fact
(01:38:10)(Sean)Locki, people who like ET want WW2 and strafe jumping
(01:38:18)(Pytox_)i still have some etqw footage of valley somewhere on my hdd lol
(01:38:19)(stealth6)Q3 & W:ET had strafe jump
(01:38:23)(Pytox_)it was mostly gameplay
(01:38:28)  join: (amazinglarry) (webchat@pool-74-104-113-156.bstnma.fios.verizon.net)
(01:38:30)(@Anti-)Sean, really dont think they want WW2
(01:38:38)(cause|Rex)the problem is also you can't do much with jumping atm
(01:38:43)(Pytox_)ww2 is kinda meh same as modern day shooters
(01:38:48)(@Anti-)is nice, but not a game changer surely, if feel is the same
(01:38:52)(cause|Rex)style doesn't care, but the gameplay does!
(01:38:52)(Sean)everybody I've spoken to at my LANs, online etc. is "Wish SD would release another WW2 shooter"
(01:39:12)(@Anti-)hmm, surprised at that
(01:39:18)(SockDog)People are stupid
(01:39:19)(Sean)it's been such a massive topic within my little circle of LAN players, etc. recently
(01:39:20)(@mitsuhiko)i doubt the WW2 aspect is very strong
(01:39:22)(@Anti-)I've always seen gameplay over all else reading Crossfire
(01:39:23)(cause|Rex)well and QW fans want QW2 :D
(01:39:28)(Pytox_):D
(01:39:35)(DarkangelUK)"I wish they'd remake x game, its awesome, loads of people want it and we miss it".... like x game doesn't exist anymore and cant be played!
(01:39:35)(cause|Rex)but doesn't matter now
(01:39:36)(Sean)hence why I dreamt about it a week before being invited to this game :D
(01:39:38)(Pytox_)or why not germans vs strogg?
(01:39:38)(Locki)we made the decision not to go too futuristic, so DB would feel contemporary (lots of projectile and hitscan skill based weapons - no laaaasers etc)
(01:39:50)(amazinglarry)Well, no Vanilla servers, DUK :P
(01:39:52)(SockDog)People want what they haven't got. 3 years ago they wouldn't piss on WW2 if it was on fire
(01:39:55)(stealth6)DarkangelUK +1
(01:39:58)(SockDog)now zombie games are TIRED.
(01:39:58)(cause|Rex)well I'm fine with the setting
(01:40:03)(@Anti-)and I REALLY wanted lasers! :)
(01:40:03)(cause|Rex)near future is also good
(01:40:07)(Pytox_)same with modern day shooters
(01:40:15)(Pytox_)like moh & cod & bf
(01:40:22)(SockDog)I think SD needs to just release a whole game skin pack so people can play in whatever era they want.
(01:40:28)(Pytox_)heh
(01:40:43)(Locki)We've done WW2, Survival Horror, Alien Invasion/SciFi, Futurism, and now contemporary. Next must be guns versus magic!!! :)
(01:40:47)(@Anti-)Pink Pony mod! :D
(01:40:56)(stealth6)SockDog or leave it up to the modders - wait... :)
(01:40:59)(cause|Rex):D
(01:41:05)(Pytox_)an ev that let's you go back to the future! :D
(01:41:05)(Locki)Also cartoon, if you include RAD L(
(01:41:15)(amazinglarry)Can it be called Guns vs Magic?
(01:41:16)(Sean)forget the WW2, but include some sort of skill level for movement instead of W & shift
(01:41:16)(SockDog)I have to say two things. Really love it being in London, represent. and I love the ragdolls.
(01:41:31)(@mitsuhiko)nazi wizards vs. roman dinoaurs
(01:41:35)(Locki)There's no gameplay balance/style that will ever please everyone though.
(01:41:37)(Pytox_)yea better then people complaining where are the ragdolls!!!
(01:41:40)(Pytox_)heh
(01:41:43)(Sean)that's true
(01:41:54)(amazinglarry)A style where I kill many people always pleases me.
(01:41:54)(cause|Rex)no but seriously at this state you will scare the people off, if you will show the gameplay now
(01:41:55)(Sean)without the unique movement that ET/Quake had, you're just going to have another FPS gamae
(01:41:59)(Locki)On the player speed, higher = fun, slower = better animations
(01:42:03)(stealth6)pirate ninjas vs dinosaurs
(01:42:22)(Locki)Which aspect Rex?
(01:42:24)(SockDog)Pytox_: Shut up you ragdoll! :)
(01:42:25)(Sean)I already have people on my FB saying "another cod game"
(01:42:35)(cause|Rex)movement + fights
(01:42:46)(cause|Rex)maps need also a workover
(01:42:46)(Sean)Locki, as much as I hate to agree wtih cause|Rex, he's right. You will scare people off if you show basic movement like in Call of Duty, Battlefield etc.
(01:42:58)(amazinglarry)ehh
(01:43:11)(Locki)By fights, do you mean lower lethality?
(01:43:17)(DarkangelUK)Sean without the unique movement ET and ETQW had, I wouldn't have spent years tricking in them
(01:43:23)(Sean)yeah
(01:43:43)(Pytox_)can you actually do trickjumps? i haven't tried it out
(01:43:49)(amazinglarry)Get some 'easy to learn / hard to master' SD trademarks and I'll be happy
(01:43:55)(stealth6)Pytox_ no
(01:43:57)(SockDog)There isn't much to the jumps
(01:43:57)(cause|Rex)small example: if someone surprises you from behind and already hit you once, you should be still able to kill him if you are the better aimer/player
(01:44:01)(Sean)here's 4 LEGENDARY videos in ET http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxEVqR2H0pw&playnext=1&list=PLA4D3989498F6B9C5&feature=results_video
(01:44:06)(Sean)and none of them are legendary for the frags
(01:44:07)(Locki)Do you know it all came from our Q3F skill jump maps?
(01:44:09)(Sean)all legendary for the movement
(01:44:33)(Locki)(after the Quake Done Quick stuff, which I should credit first of course)
(01:45:05)(SockDog)It would be nice if there were some additional elements to movement but I'm not all in for this Locki gang bang to just make W:ET or ETQW again.
(01:45:27)(SockDog)You guys needs to move on a bit too.
(01:45:28)(Locki)Watch this:
(01:45:29)(@Anti-)dancing is something only vets will want
(01:45:32)(Locki)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuJgAh6mkpE
(01:45:38)(@Anti-)anybody in last 5 years new to FPS will hate it
(01:45:43)(Sean)ET:QW is my personal favourite game of all time, but the people who played ET before ET:QW disagree entirely. That's why ET is still played like it is 10 years on and ET:QW isn't.
(01:45:44)(Locki)(Our work four years before Wolf ET)
(01:45:44)(cause|Rex)SockDog you are alone with your opinion
(01:45:45)(Pytox_)yea because some want more close combat and others more open spaces
(01:45:53)(Locki)_thats_ movement!! :)
(01:46:09)(cause|Rex)read what the people wrote below the teaser...
(01:46:18)(@mitsuhiko)the movement aspect is something that was never planned, the community found it
(01:46:23)(SockDog)cause|Rex: The teaser that showed nothing?
(01:46:33)(dommafia|2)The teaser comments mean nothing
(01:46:44)(cause|Rex)SockDog from which game are you from?
(01:46:47)(Locki)Watch this (a friend, trickjumping, in our first mod Q3F): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuJgAh6mkpE
(01:46:56)(dommafia|2)basically we can take away people dont want brink 2
(01:46:58)(dommafia|2)which it isn't
(01:47:05)(Sean)Locki, I'd take that movement over the current game movement any day. Your 1st link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuJgAh6mkpE
(01:47:15)(dommafia|2)but the movement shooting while moving (strafing) does need to be more fluid
(01:47:19)(DarkangelUK)seems everyone was doing the flashy jumps, I liked to also do the technical stuff http://www.dundee-ehd.co.uk/videos/etjump.html
(01:47:36)(Pytox_)is it possible to have sort of the same movement in ut engine?
(01:47:44)(SockDog)cause|Rex: Q3, RTCW, Cod, Cod:UO, ETQW, L4D
(01:47:56)(cause|Rex)ok thx for info
(01:47:58)  join: (Vahl) (webchat@cpc24-bmly9-2-0-cust237.2-3.cable.virginmedia.com)
(01:48:20)(dommafia|2)I really do not need trick jumping, but all the little things that slow down the shooting while moving are annoying
(01:48:20)(Locki)We can _fake_ it
(01:48:20)(cause|Rex)murka already said to open a new thread to sum the wishes up once again
(01:48:29)(Locki)It was all caused by a bug in id Tech
(01:48:42)(Locki)Well a couple of bugs - to do with strafing and trimping
(01:48:56)(@mitsuhiko)pretty much my point. it was never intended :)
(01:49:24)(dommafia|2)Locki the way you have setup the body shot damage and headshot damage are very good, now if we could slow down the ROF on these guns
(01:49:25)(Locki)yes - they're just bugs that will get fixed
(01:49:37)(Sean)mitsuhiko, some accidents are good ones
(01:49:40)(Sean)like when I was born :D
(01:49:43)(DarkangelUK)mitsuhiko it was never removed either :P
(01:49:46)(Locki)Like Soldier 02's ?
(01:49:47)(SockDog)But it's nice, I see why people like it. BUT I don't see it as the core problem of DB.
(01:49:50)(@mitsuhiko)DarkangelUK: no, because people liked it :)
(01:50:01)(SockDog)I think there are better things to balance than recreating games of old.
(01:50:12)(stealth6)I've got the solution
(01:50:16)(DarkangelUK)its not recreating the game, its recreating the feeling
(01:50:17)(stealth6)cvar it
(01:50:18)(@RR2DO2)Locki: I always preferred Chapter 3 over that one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=FQ2r_2hZ8q8
(01:50:20)(SockDog)I learnt a long time ago that I'll never get that Q3 experience I once had.
(01:50:27)(Pytox_)and nade jumping would be cool
(01:50:27)(cause|Rex)the recreation leads to success though!
(01:50:33)(Sean)SockDog, sort movement first, then balance the game based on how the movement is imo
(01:50:34)(Locki)id Software tried to maintain the same gameplay in every new engine.
(01:50:35)(SockDog)Each game should be individual.
(01:50:52)(DarkangelUK)you can strafe like a demon in Rage... you can go faster than the buggy
(01:50:52)(Pytox_)apart from rage ofc :)
(01:50:53)(SockDog)Sean: Yup, I'd agree with that. That is fair
(01:50:59)(@mitsuhiko)RR2DO2: better music
(01:51:00)(Locki)I have to agree - without taking a risk, we wouldn't have got Wolf ET (or Q3F)
(01:51:18)(Sean)Locki, do ya feel lucky punk? Do ya?
(01:51:19)(dommafia|2)No one is asking for remake -_- When something is done right, it bares repeating. Et gunfights were ALWAYS a good challenge of skill
(01:51:23)(dommafia|2)not who saw who first
(01:51:30)(@RR2DO2)mitsuhiko: more fluid
(01:51:36)(Sean)I think good fluid, fast movement is the key here
(01:51:44)(cause|Rex)well if you are going to create a completely new game you are on a good way...
(01:51:46)(Sean)make that happen, make some maps to suit it, make the balance changes to suit it
(01:51:51)(Sean)and you've got GOTY already
(01:51:54)(DarkangelUK)nothing like a good flow
(01:51:55)(SockDog)But not necessarily the same movement. :)
(01:52:12)(@Anti-)so why didn't it work for TA then?
(01:52:20)(@Anti-)fast and fluid there but so many turned away
(01:52:24)(Sean)because HiRez failed in supporting the game properly
(01:52:25)(Locki)The goal of DB is to bring (kicking and screaming!) our old-school Teamplay, ten years in to the future. I definitely think gunplay should be skill based, but BRINK's solution of lower lethality did not work.
(01:52:29)(@mitsuhiko)Anti-: stupid business model, bad maps :)
(01:52:29)(Sean)stupid little bugs, Anti-
(01:52:34)(@mitsuhiko)and bad community support
(01:52:38)(@Anti-)they left before support ended mostly
(01:53:07)(Sean)nah, I was in the top TA channels and HiRez employees would pop in (mainly Bart) and everybody hated him for the amount of empty promises he made
(01:53:08)(SockDog)TBH TA turned me away because of the F2P
(01:53:09)(dommafia|2)lower lethality but missing other ingredients was the issue
(01:53:18)(Sean)as soon as SMITE was announced, they more or less dropped the TA community
(01:53:18)(dommafia|2)the cone of each gun :\
(01:53:22)(DarkangelUK)I wasnt a fan of TA's movement, it's hard to explain, but it was slow....
(01:53:24)(Sean)anyway, getting a cup of tea
(01:53:27)(@Anti-)which top TA channels? :)
(01:53:32)(SockDog)I just didn't want to invest the time in a game that would ask for more and more.
(01:53:36)(Sean)yeah DarkangelUK, it wasn't original Tribes movement :P
(01:53:45)(Sean)Anti-, the main scrim ones on Gamesurge
(01:53:50)(Sean)brb cup of tea
(01:53:57)(@Anti-)Tribes lives on Quakenet :P
(01:54:04)(DarkangelUK)silly angles, timings, paths
(01:54:17)(Locki)I played Tribes 1 month 1, and when we played Tribes 2, people hated it, but then it became dominant, and nobody liked Vengeance :)
(01:54:29)(Locki)then they did!
(01:54:37)(Locki)Dom - what's the simple solution?
(01:54:40)(cause|Rex)I think we should open a new thread to make it more clear for you with good reasons :)
(01:54:45)(Locki)yes
(01:54:47)(Locki)but!
(01:54:59)(Locki)It has to be quick, because we're working on gameplay now
(01:55:04)(SockDog)But first, fill in the MOD/MAP thread. :)
(01:55:05)(Pytox_)more large posts to read through :p
(01:55:07)(stealth6)I... I like TA
(01:55:14)(cause|Rex)yes tomorrow I think
(01:55:17)(@Anti-)Rex, I think we understand better than you realise :)
(01:55:20)(DarkangelUK)wow found some old rtcw jumps http://www.dundee-ehd.co.uk/videos/rtcwjump.html
(01:55:20)(cause|Rex)good to know Locki
(01:55:23)(Locki)however, our first movie is really more about showcasing objectives in contemporary settings, so don't worry too much about gunplay yet
(01:55:24)(SockDog)Now or your thread fails.
(01:55:34)(cause|Rex)Anti- I do hope so!
(01:55:37)(@Anti-)but you guys maybe dont always give credit to how difference and changed the FPS audience is now compared to 2002-2007
(01:55:38)(Pytox_)I also liked in w:et the reloading speed of the thompson and mp40
(01:55:47)(@Anti-)different*
(01:55:50)(cause|Rex)all your old fans count on you!
(01:55:54)(@Anti-)because you're so close to old games
(01:55:56)(SockDog)Anti-: I do, sometimes with tears.
(01:56:03)(@Anti-)I know Rex :)
(01:56:16)(Pytox_)Locki sort of like the old etqw introduction video? That was pretty good
(01:56:18)(dommafia|2)Locki, accurate hipfire (which u have done, more would be nice), slower ROF, and being able to sprint while strafing.
(01:56:18)(@Anti-)but TA vets like me didnt want exactly T2 again
(01:56:22)(@Anti-)even though we said we did
(01:56:32)(stealth6)DarkangelUK seen this yet? http://youtu.be/LhilvSaYuOQ
(01:56:33)(SockDog)I do think people need to move on though. I just don't like core gameplay being thrown under the bus to implement something that isn't FPS
(01:56:37)(Locki)I can tell you stories about NEAR DEATH THREATS from fans who SWORE I changed Thompson/MP40 balance (but didn't know we just changed audio).
(01:56:44)(@Anti-)little things in T2 sucked, which TA fixed
(01:56:54)(cause|Rex)btw it so awesome that you spend time talking to the community. Big thanks for that!
(01:56:55)(Pytox_)sort of like this ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnfblgFeHSg
(01:57:05)(@Anti-)I'd love to know what you guys think sucked in ETQW and W:ET
(01:57:12)(SockDog)Locki: They said the same in ETQW threads, even when SD said nothing had changed on weapons.
(01:57:13)(dommafia|2)in et? not much :)
(01:57:25)(DarkangelUK)unlocks
(01:57:37)(Locki)I loved ETQW - that's really my personal (flawed) masterpiece.
(01:57:37)(DarkangelUK)but thats not getting removed so no point discussing
(01:57:38)(dommafia|2)well i keep thinking of et as it was from ETPRO
(01:57:43)(dommafia|2)i dont remember the vanilla days
(01:57:44)(SockDog)AI Unlocks FTW! It's the future! :)
(01:57:50)(Locki)I imagined playing that for years before I made it.
(01:57:58)(cause|Rex)indeed Locki ;)
(01:58:09)(Locki)by 1.4 I was happier with it
(01:58:16)(cause|Rex)Anti- maybe the netcode was bad
(01:58:19)(DarkangelUK)stealth6 awful music but nice jumps
(01:58:20)(dommafia|2)etqw had great gunfights
(01:58:22)(Locki)Anti helped fix it by the way - he production tested it like crazy back then
(01:58:36)(cause|Rex)apart from some minor bugs it was very good
(01:58:50)(Locki)The two guys in charge of design on DB, are both the main testers from ETQW
(01:59:02)(cause|Rex)netcode was the biggest problem in QW people complained
(01:59:11)(Locki)(Anti and Smooth - Now Designer and Producer)
(01:59:12)(cause|Rex)greets from the whole qw com!
(01:59:14)(dommafia|2)I think I'm just too stuck in the old days, I'm just gonna sit back and see where the gunfight dynamics head towards in DB.
(01:59:17)(Pytox_)also do not do an exclusive beta like with etqw
(01:59:17)(SockDog)ETQW was nice, I think a big problem with it was the lack of players. Not being a dick here but it reached stagnation, at that point the skill level starts getting higher and higher which then eats even more into the community. I think it's very important to focus on ways to bring in new players and nuture them to a competent level
(01:59:18)(@Anti-)I played more ETQW after release than I did in testing as well :>
(01:59:36)(Locki)hey so lemme tell you something secret - but keep stoom till I post the blog about it ok?
(01:59:44)(DarkangelUK)ETQW for me was too many turret spots
(01:59:58)(DarkangelUK)especially valley when the MCP was exiting the tunnel
(01:59:59)(amazinglarry)My only real complaint about QW was mainly the vehicles. They had their place, but I prefer infantry combat over all else.
(02:00:00)(cause|Rex)go for it
(02:00:01)(Pytox_)i hated that exclusive beta thing on filefront? ( or what was the name again )
(02:00:16)(Locki)yes - we were one year too later with it. had it released in 2006 as planned, it would have dominated - but then 2142 ripped us off etc
(02:00:24)(Pytox_)yea didn't like all the turret spam on etqw
(02:00:35)(stealth6)What has changed so much in gamers since 2002? All I know is they care a lot about graphics and can be cattled anywhere you like
(02:00:49)(cause|Rex)yes saw the first trailers in 06?
(02:01:04)(Pytox_)yea i still have some of my hdd from e3 :D
(02:01:10)(cause|Rex)SD fans are completely different stealth6 ;)
(02:01:16)(SockDog)Locki: The delays have cost you guys a lot, and sometimes the idea you can add stuff after release.
(02:01:43)(SockDog)stealth6: There are lots of new gamers now. Nobody changed, they are just new and that is all they know.
(02:01:49)(cause|Rex)one problem about QW was maybe that it was too complex
(02:01:54)(SockDog)Herp derp, CoD/Halo is awesome.
(02:01:56)(cause|Rex)and a bit beginner unfriendly
(02:02:06)(cause|Rex)but the complexity was the best!
(02:02:08)(Pytox_)yea
(02:02:22)(cause|Rex)but some cod kiddies couldn't get into it...
(02:02:22)(stealth6)Ye, but I mean why would they hate it if you released a game exactly the same as W:ET now, but with nice graphics?
(02:02:27)(Pytox_)and some are too stupid to watch a tutorial ofc ...
(02:02:32)(Locki)That's why I want players in DB now - not waiting another year
(02:02:35)(murka^L2)i would rape with the bumblebee if only my team had a decent anansi
(02:02:49)(Locki)I was the BEST anansi pilot ever :)
(02:02:54)(SockDog)cause|Rex: This is true for all SD games, there is a lot to learn out of the gate. I knew there was more to ETQW so I pushed through but others just turned away. That's why I think other modes and challenges are going to be key to keeping people playing.
(02:03:02)(cause|Rex)to the next tree? :D
(02:03:06)(murka^L2)i bet dom, szak and the others would like to disagree
(02:03:14)(Pytox_)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlDFjwNb8Wo :D
(02:03:19)(DarkangelUK)stealth6 I was so lazy and took ages to release a trick movie, ended up doing something simple in a couple days http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=OjH2E7GNfrM#t=64s
(02:03:35)(cause|Rex)even after 5 years (!) I figured out new things in QW...it's just incredible
(02:03:36)(DarkangelUK)was miffed with myself for waiting so long then releasing a crappy vid
(02:03:52)(@Anti-)SockDog
(02:04:02)(@Anti-)I really want to find a way to teach players
(02:04:03)(stealth6)DarkangelUK don't think you're forgotten on the TJ scene pupup0x like throwing your name around when the subject of who found originals comes up
(02:04:14)(@Anti-)not the weapons and abilities with descriptions how we do now
(02:04:23)(@Anti-)but actually the mechanic of playing FPS games
(02:04:27)(@Anti-)I think that is key
(02:04:32)(DarkangelUK)a nice :)
(02:04:35)(@Anti-)MOBA communities do this so well for character
(02:04:35)(@Anti-)s
(02:04:40)(SockDog)cause|Rex: Things being open enough to discover new things is something FPS can do more of. I think the DayZ stuff will eventually find some place in MP.
(02:04:40)(@Anti-)FPS games dont
(02:05:20)(cause|Rex)you learn the most from other people
(02:05:27)(SockDog)Anti-: Yup, it's not something I'd say was obvious but there are ways I think. The horde mode might be a good idea.
(02:05:27)(@Anti-)yep
(02:05:31)(cause|Rex)joininh a clan is good idea
(02:06:02)(cause|Rex)I haven't seen any newbie guide in QW though :(
(02:06:06)(stealth6)DarkangelUK probs don't know that name, but I forgot what his old one was, some racist Finn (hmm that doesn't really narrow it down)
(02:06:13)(Pytox_)there was a tutorial cause|Rex
(02:06:17)(Pytox_):D
(02:06:20)(cause|Rex)where?
(02:06:22)(Locki)We have a new system - an online technology - called Echo. It records EVERY movement of every player in every server in every match, every shot fired, and we're able to drill down on any aspect of balance - create heatmaps, and look at stats, from specific builds, or specific geographic regions. Theoretically, we've got true data-driven balancing for the first time ever. We have server-side demo recording too, so we're
(02:06:23)(SockDog)With a co-op mode that has objectives you would learn core skills without the FPS heavy distractions
(02:06:27)(DarkangelUK)stealth6 Wasted?
(02:06:33)(Pytox_)a gdf and strogg tutorial let me post again
(02:06:52)(stealth6)nope
(02:06:58)(cause|Rex)sounds great!
(02:07:17)(Pytox_)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OQ-pc55n-Y
(02:07:18)(amazinglarry)Damn Locki that was my idea for when I build an FPS lol
(02:07:23)(Locki)We're even able to balance regularity of death animations - making every aspect more objectively satisfying.
(02:07:25)(amazinglarry)Obviously been eavesdropping on me
(02:07:29)(SockDog)Locki: That sounds awesome, will this be part of the user level release? Heatmaps, demos and such?
(02:07:47)(Locki)but its super secret till next week or the week after when I post the blog ok - it's a big piece of fireteam work
(02:07:49)(cause|Rex)I know those Pytox_
(02:07:51)(Pytox_)heh
(02:08:00)(cause|Rex)but I mean guides for more advanced playing
(02:08:06) SockDog zips
(02:08:06)(cause|Rex)timing nades, mine posistions
(02:08:12)(Pytox_)ah no that there were not you had to find out yourself
(02:08:14)(Locki)Guess who is programming it?
(02:08:14)(cause|Rex)spawn times etc.
(02:08:15)(DarkangelUK)what was that ET mod that gave a top down reatilme view of the game?
(02:08:20)(SockDog)ducks
(02:08:27)(Pytox_)yea that was what i was trying to find DarkangelUK
(02:08:32)(Pytox_)the realtime w:et mod :p
(02:08:38)(@mitsuhiko)i have no idea what Locki is talking about :P
(02:08:41)(Locki)Dave Johnston - our LD (who made Dust btw) and he's obsessed with solving this balance problem perfectly
(02:08:48)(SockDog)Bingo
(02:08:52)(Pytox_)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gbhi2eq-_o0
(02:08:55)(Pytox_)This was awesome
(02:08:59)(Pytox_)DarkangelUK: that was it
(02:09:03)(stealth6)oh that mod... that's buried somewhere on SD lol
(02:09:06)(cause|Rex)can't wait to read the blog article
(02:09:09)(SockDog)Ducks is the genius
(02:09:14)(DarkangelUK)did you know you're not actually allowed to say Dave 'Ducks' Johnston without mentioning Dust? Its part of legel agreement
(02:09:32)(DarkangelUK)yeah lithium mod
(02:09:32)(Locki)we call him Dave Dust in the office :)
(02:09:40)(Pytox_)that mod is nice to see overview of the maps
(02:09:54)(SockDog)Does he? I mean, dust as well as make maps and awesome tech?
(02:10:00)(SockDog)I need a cleaner.
(02:10:01)(Locki)I gotta go to bed and watch season 4 of breaking bad
(02:10:06)(Pytox_)o_O :D
(02:10:22)(DarkangelUK)I gotta go to bed cos im up at 6am _
(02:10:22)(SockDog)nn Locki
(02:10:27)(Pytox_)nn
(02:10:37)(stealth6)bye
(02:10:47)(Locki)we defo need to do the gameplay movie because I want people in the beta before Christmas - I think it's critical to get this title Tested by Gamers (unlike that other game, you know which)
(02:10:47)(cause|Rex)good night
(02:11:03)(Pytox_)you mean Cod? :D
(02:11:08)(stealth6)beta by christmas... wow
(02:11:08)(SockDog)Peggle
(02:11:11)(Pytox_)lol
(02:11:16)(SockDog)Deep peggle testing
(02:11:19) DarkangelUK shoots Pytox_
(02:11:22)(Pytox_)inb4 hl3 that's what i say
(02:11:22)(Locki)selected alpha by christmas is fairer
(02:11:31)(SockDog)Save it for the wife DA
(02:11:52)(SockDog)Locki: When it's done. :)
(02:11:53)(@mitsuhiko)let's not call it a beta ;)
(02:11:58)(DarkangelUK)your wife's had enough from me SockDog
(02:12:02)(DarkangelUK)zing!
(02:12:03)(Pytox_)or christmas using valve time?
(02:12:06)(Pytox_):)
(02:12:16)(SockDog)She has very low standards
(02:12:24)(DarkangelUK)well she did marry you
(02:12:35)  join: (INF3RN0) (webchat@c-50-137-168-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
(02:12:35)(SockDog)Exactly and then cheat on me with you.
(02:12:45)(SockDog)For milk bottle tops.
(02:12:46)(cause|Rex)an open beta?
(02:12:52)(SockDog)Blue peter whore
(02:12:56)(Pytox_)better not open
(02:13:01)(DarkangelUK)here's one I did earlier?
(02:13:02)(Locki)Seriously - within weeks I want to separate it in to two halves.. A sort of secret bit you guys still have access too (for testing upcoming characters and maps), and then the core (let's call it ET style game) and publishable maps, that could be played by a wide audience.
(02:13:06)(SockDog)LOL
(02:13:09)(Locki)no no not open
(02:13:16)(Locki)super closed
(02:13:19)(stealth6)http://i.imgur.com/GScgo.jpg
(02:13:23)(cause|Rex)good!
(02:13:24)(Pytox_)wasn't it filefront for etqw open beta?
(02:13:35)(@mitsuhiko)Pytox_: let's not repeat mistakes :)
(02:13:36)(Pytox_)with the exclusive access thing
(02:13:42)(DarkangelUK)yeah
(02:13:43)(Pytox_)didn't like that all :D
(02:13:55)(@mitsuhiko)feedback is only valuable if the
(02:13:56)(Locki)no - that was different
(02:13:57)(INF3RN0)no open beta until i approve :D
(02:13:58)(@mitsuhiko)base is small
(02:14:00)(Donnovan)still trying to reach the end of the conversation... here nice movement movie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAjXCWHVJh8
(02:14:19)(Locki)open beta = demo
(02:14:24)(Donnovan)back to 3 pages above :D
(02:14:30)(Pytox_)yea was same with MoH
(02:14:37)(Pytox_)everyone reviewed it as a demo
(02:14:40)(Locki)yes!
(02:14:52)(SockDog)Locki: Please lots of polish time and feature implementation
(02:15:05)(cause|Rex)it is sad that nowaday most games get released as a beta...
(02:15:06)(Locki)I think we could keep it closed to summer
(02:15:13)(DarkangelUK)right moff, gonna be knackered tomorrow. GN!
(02:15:15)(INF3RN0)has the next wave of alpha testers arrived yet??
(02:15:18)(SockDog)NN DA
(02:15:19)(Locki)Rex - you say that, but BRINK was released without Beta
(02:15:26)(Pytox_)nn heh :p
(02:15:31)(cause|Rex)yeah for a good reason
(02:15:32)(Locki)night da
(02:15:35)(cause|Rex)cu
(02:15:39)  quit: (DarkangelUK) (~me@78.32.73.67) (Signed off)
(02:15:44)(Locki)how do you mean?
(02:15:58)(cause|Rex)I wouldn't have bought it ;)
(02:16:09)(stealth6)Donnovan don't think we should get defrag in DB, wrong weapons and style imo
(02:16:17)(Locki)If it had a beta, it would have been more polished.
(02:16:28)(Locki)Anyway, that's old history.
(02:16:28)(INF3RN0)^
(02:16:34)(Pytox_):)
(02:16:38)(cause|Rex)yeah its the past ;)
(02:16:41)(cause|Rex)we are over it
(02:16:45)(Locki)So back to DB
(02:16:49)(SockDog)YES. Moving on, migratory blue tit mating calls
(02:16:52)(stealth6)there's nothing wrong with a beta except the word
(02:17:09)(Pytox_)yes people think sometimes beta = nearly ready
(02:17:10)(@RR2DO2)call it warmup
(02:17:11)(stealth6)nowadays beta is justt a marketing term for try the game months ahead
(02:17:19)(SockDog)+1 RR2DO2
(02:17:35)(SockDog)That would be great, instead of Open Beta you have a Warmup.
(02:17:39)(SockDog)Awesome
(02:17:46)(cause|Rex)some games don't even need betas like CoD
(02:17:49)(Locki)DB is dedicated PC - there's no console port. BRINK came from console to PC. DB is being tested by VIPS. Then a closed-alpha for probably three months. Then a closed beta for probably another three months. Even when it does go open, we probably will let people play the core game for nothing.
(02:18:05)(SockDog)cause|Rex: That's because CoD hasn't changed since erm CoD.
(02:18:08)(stealth6)do they do beta on xbox?
(02:18:13)(INF3RN0)Just something I wanted to note regarding DB and it's appeal to f2p players. They aren't as afraid of a high-skill/learning curve game, considering most f2p titles are CS clones. Only time you have to cater to crowds is on console ;).
(02:18:27)(Pytox_)yea blacklight is a cod clone heh
(02:18:46)(cause|Rex)is it sure that it will be f2p now?
(02:18:53)(cause|Rex)or can't you tell us yet?
(02:18:57)(INF3RN0)well I only assumed :o
(02:19:11)(Locki)We're much more interested in clan and tournament support than F2P gamers.
(02:19:13)(SockDog)I played Blacklight for less time than I downloaded it, just no contact in the weapons, urrggh.
(02:19:22)(@Anti-)by the way INF3RN0, what other FPS games do you play?
(02:19:26)(cause|Rex)Locki that's the right way!!!
(02:19:27)(@Anti-)you're pretty damned good
(02:19:47)(INF3RN0)I started with RTS then went into ETQW first ;o
(02:19:56)(@Anti-)in a clan?
(02:20:10)(INF3RN0)yea... played at WCG 2010 for USA ;)
(02:20:19)(@Anti-)in ETQW?
(02:20:23)(cause|Rex)without the euros :D
(02:20:25)(INF3RN0)otherwise random mixes in etqw leagues. and yep
(02:20:35)(INF3RN0)etqw online was horrid though
(02:20:36)(INF3RN0)haha
(02:20:49)(@Anti-)I never realised ETQW went to WCG :D
(02:20:50)(INF3RN0)the korean version i mean
(02:20:53)(cause|Rex)yeah but you could have defied them ;)
(02:20:55)(INF3RN0)it was a korean remake
(02:21:02)(cause|Rex)QW for noobs^^
(02:21:05)(Locki)Personally, I like Trent Reznor's business model. You can get cool tracks for free. You can buy some. And there's awesome fan packages and credits for those that want them. And that's it really.
(02:21:07)(@Anti-)all I knew about was Crossfire LAN and Quakecon
(02:21:12)(INF3RN0)but we did a qualifier on ETQW
(02:21:13)(cause|Rex)to suit the non shooter audience there
(02:21:31)(Pytox_)please be not like tf2 with all the hats and stuff
(02:21:34)(Pytox_)heh
(02:21:43)(Locki)No, not at all like TF2
(02:21:50)(Sean)(00:20:55) (INF3RN0) but we did a qualifier on ETQW
(02:21:52)(SockDog)Locki: You guys need to make some money but I'd appreciate innovative ways of doing it. Have you read the F2P thread?
(02:21:55)(Sean)QWO was an awesome game!
(02:21:57)(Sean):P
(02:21:59)(INF3RN0)LOL
(02:22:08)(Locki)Let me run an idea past you guys.... It's not a commitment, but just an idea and I want to see what you think ok?
(02:22:11)(Sean)tbh, I did like their renditions of the games
(02:22:13)(Pytox_)ok
(02:22:16)(Sean)go for it Locki!
(02:22:21)(Locki)Yes - I read it completely.
(02:22:24)(Pytox_)move move move!
(02:22:25)(Pytox_):D
(02:22:29)(cause|Rex)my money? take it! But I got no clue how you will get it if it is f2p...
(02:22:31)(SockDog)Shweet
(02:22:32)(INF3RN0)Locki all I can say is never go down the pay2win route
(02:22:35)(Locki)(...and I'm really well read and researched on all the models too).
(02:22:39)(INF3RN0)thats the biggest killer in f2p
(02:22:41)(Locki)Ok...
(02:23:06)(cause|Rex)yep indeed
(02:23:13)(INF3RN0)I spent like 1-2years in f2p after etqw because they had more tournaments than official games lol
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(02:23:30)(Locki)So here's om caveats: I hate Pay2Win. I also hate this Psuedo-Currency that is little more than casino chips that make you think you're not spending real money. I also think people should play without paying anything if they want.
(02:23:52)(Locki)Got that so far?
(02:23:56)(SockDog)yup
(02:23:59)(Pytox_)yea
(02:23:59)(INF3RN0)Yups
(02:24:03)(stealth6)you lost me at caveats
(02:24:06)(stealth6)jk
(02:24:06)(Pytox_):p
(02:24:13) SockDog cuddles stealth6
(02:24:22)(Sean)yes, and it's an awesome angle to come from <3
(02:24:55)(Locki)I believe that a great multiplayer, at its core, needs a hard core competitive community FIRST. If it achieves that, it will stay around for years. You can't charge those guys because some simply can't afford stupid exploitative amounts of money to play a shooter.
(02:25:26)(stealth6)Still following
(02:25:28)(Pytox_)yes
(02:25:36)(Sean)if you keep this attitude up, you'll end up being my hero. Continue
(02:25:44)(murka^L2)indeed
(02:25:45)(SockDog)True, I think that pub is a base but competitive (at different levels) are the peaks
(02:25:48)(Pytox_)you want sort of like quake live?
(02:25:49)(@Anti-)this is the bit where I got told I'm not going to be paid anymore and have to work for free! :D
(02:25:54)(INF3RN0)well I for one have moved back into casual play, but 'casual' never means that I don't want a game that isn't equally competitive
(02:25:59)(cause|Rex)So damn right Locki! +10000000000 for the last sentence
(02:26:00)(Locki)So you really need a dual model. One that keeps pubbers happy and busy with lots of cool content to play with and stay fresh, but you also need a great tournament game that doesn't have crazxy weapon upgrades that are impossible to balance (or dual against).
(02:26:04)(Pytox_)with a premium membership?
(02:26:08)(cause|Rex)that's why we love SD!
(02:26:35)(Sean)no Pytox_, QL model failed hard
(02:26:37)(Pytox_)yea tournament guys also need custom tournament maps
(02:26:46)(Pytox_)like in et
(02:26:50) SockDog send Anti biscuit basket.
(02:27:02)(Pytox_)sometimes at least :)
(02:27:04)(@mitsuhiko)Anti- is just too scared :)
(02:27:26)(stealth6)I think rightly so
(02:27:41)(INF3RN0)So what's the plan to make $$ ;o
(02:27:42)(Locki)What if there was a hybrid model: Firstly, FREE for core gamers - that's your basic five classes, all objective modes, and so on. I assume we'd allow people to run dedicated servers (but I can't confirm that). Then there's the Pay-what-You-Want guys - fans who want to contribute, and we'd provide packages - they don't HAVE TOO but we take care of them with cool stuff if they do.
(02:27:44)(stealth6)if people can easily get away with not paying...
(02:28:15)(amazinglarry)I dig
(02:28:23)(INF3RN0)honestly it's a difficult thing to approach, but I think that most people wouldn'
(02:28:24)(Locki)We'd never charge for multiplayer maps, cause that's stupid and splits the community.
(02:28:28)(Pytox_)as long as it doesn't feel being greedy like with ea it's fine
(02:28:31) SockDog throwing credit cards at screen
(02:28:36)(INF3RN0)wouldnt want separate communities
(02:28:55)(amazinglarry)Sockdog you need to put it IN the computer, not the monitor, duh.
(02:28:58)(Pytox_)tournament guys don't want pubs on their game
(02:29:02)(INF3RN0)You would be very surprised by the fact that most people willing to pay for items in game will buy them regardless of whether they need them or not
(02:29:05)(Locki)But for those that don't want to pay anything, we wouldn't give them the special classes - these new characters are NOT more powerful, but they DO have more other fun stuff to do. These could be charged for - and this is the third model.
(02:29:07)(Sean)Locki, what about adding items in-game that people can buy to support their favourite competing teams? Right now people are going crazy over team merch like tshirts, phone covers etc. And most recently we see Valve incorporating the pendant into their game.
(02:29:14)(SockDog)I think for a Pro/Competitive pack it's worth charging if you get stuff pro/competitive people want/need/
(02:29:25)(Sean)you share the revenue with those teams on a 50/50 basis
(02:29:35)(SockDog)amazinglarry: I'll keep trying until I get a sense of wellbeing dammit!
(02:29:39)(Locki)Then finally, someone could pay a subscription (if they want) and just get everything unlocked, including like intel reports with heatmaps on how their enmeies play :)
(02:29:53)(Pytox_)sort of like firefall with xp boost?
(02:29:57)(Sean)SockDog, charging for competitive play is a mistake
(02:30:04)(Sean)even Nadeo have made their competitive mode F2P :P
(02:30:06)(Pytox_)yes
(02:30:06)(Locki)yes - comp must be free
(02:30:22)(INF3RN0)@Locki- just keep in mind that a lot of games have tried to do what your proposing, but in most cases these special items eventually become imba noob->pro pills.
(02:30:30)(Locki)When people join clans, they find it harder to leave and do something else - clans = switching cost
(02:30:34)(cause|Rex)the third model seems difficult to realize
(02:30:38)(SockDog)Sean: I mean for competitive tools
(02:30:40)(Locki)yes - no special items
(02:30:45)(Sean)SockDog, such as?
(02:30:50)(@Anti-)INF3RN0, do you feel that is true of something like LoL as well?
(02:30:58)(amazinglarry)hahah
(02:31:08)(@Anti-)I always feel LoL economy is quite balanced myself
(02:31:13)(Sean)Riot have done well with their micro transaction business model. I don't think anybody can deny it :D
(02:31:26)(@Anti-)but do you feel it's fair Sean?
(02:31:27)(INF3RN0)No I don't feel like LoL is comparable mostly due to the game mechanics.
(02:31:29)(SockDog)Clan management, stats, tools,
(02:31:32)(@Anti-)obviously they made money :)
(02:31:39)(SockDog)Private servers for matches
(02:31:40)(Sean)it's fair, Anti-. The people who want to spend money will spend money
(02:31:44)(Sean)and people who don't, won't
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(02:31:54)(@Anti-)and you don't feel it's pay to win?
(02:32:00)(Pytox_)would becool if you can customize tshirts and sell them :p
(02:32:03)(cause|Rex)they made by far too much money
(02:32:13)(cause|Rex)but people pay for pink hats...
(02:32:19)(Donnovan)sorry, i lost connection
(02:32:19)(SockDog)To be honest, if the game grabs me as fun I have $60 here for SD.
(02:32:21)(Locki)Summary: Hybrid business model... 1) Free core comp/tourny game, and no stupid F2P grind, 2) Pay-What-You-Want packages for contributors/founders/VIPs who we take care of 3) Season pass to get everything always, and finally once open released 4) Sell cool fun FULL characters.
(02:32:23)(INF3RN0)Well let's remember that LoL offers a huge amount of content already
(02:32:28)(stealth6)Pytox_ hold the phone why are we making a game? T-shirt sales go!!!!!!
(02:32:32)(Sean)not strictly, because pre-unlocked heroes(champions???) are balanced well enough to play against paid-for ones
(02:32:37)(SockDog)I'll happily pay more to spawn servers or rent one perminantly
(02:32:41)(amazinglarry)LoL is fair and that I never feel anything is pay to win. It's all just skins, extra 'config' pages with their runes etc.
(02:32:47)(Pytox_)i don't like season pass :(
(02:32:48)(Sean)I don't like LoL, but I do respect Riot for what they've done
(02:32:56)(Pytox_)rather would want expansion instead of season pass
(02:32:58)(@Anti-)yea, that's how I feel too, characters are balanced, so I kind of dont care if folks have ones I dont
(02:33:14)(INF3RN0)If you can prove that alternate loadouts can function equally to the free content, then you will have done something great :p
(02:33:19)(Locki)yes - that's imperative
(02:33:22)(amazinglarry)And even then, they're all purchasable with non-real currency - worst case
(02:33:33)(Sean)perhaps you could have a model where people can buy gun skins, player skins, etc.
(02:33:40)(Pytox_)charging for additional maps is a bad system too
(02:33:48)(Locki)ok
(02:33:52)(SockDog)Locki: Is there a plan for pay once unlock certain stuff perminantly though?
(02:33:54)(Locki)so simplifying it:
(02:34:05)(amazinglarry)Yeah it can segregate players (old maps -> new maps)
(02:34:12)(INF3RN0)at the same time I think that the f2p consumers are just as interested in aesthetics and making their character look unique as they are with buying extra game content
(02:34:13)(amazinglarry)but you have to recoup dev costs somehow :/
(02:34:16)(INF3RN0)possibly even more so tbh
(02:34:17)(Sean)as I said yesterday or day before in this channel, I'm totally available to talk about this over a Skype call or anything similar if you ever plan on having a gathering of testers
(02:34:26)(Pytox_)ads on billboards?
(02:34:30)(Pytox_):P
(02:34:44)(Locki)Hybrid: 1) Totally free core game, no bullshit grind, for comp/tourny play 2) Pay-What-You-Want in exchange for (not pay-2-win) awesome stuff, 3) Buy balanced cool new complete additional characters
(02:34:51)(SockDog)I'm good with ads but others, jesus the flames and pitchforks
(02:34:53)(Pytox_)1
(02:34:54)(cause|Rex)Sean do you want to try out the new skins? :P
(02:35:09)(Sean)I'll try anything man
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(02:35:37)(stealth6)OKcupid on every billboard in game... I'm feeling it
(02:35:43)(Pytox_)would you get money by kills?
(02:35:44)(cause|Rex)one mate of me is still waiting for the ass-free pants :P
(02:35:48)(Sean):P
(02:35:53)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: i would actually find that hilarious
(02:36:03)(INF3RN0)British underwear is a big seller
(02:36:05)(@mitsuhiko)but BF already did it
(02:36:16)(stealth6)I laugh everytime I open xfire, they get the right target audience
(02:36:17)(Pytox_)or aston martins all over the place in the maps :D
(02:36:25)(SockDog)Pytox needs a tshirt and then he needs to be on an ingame ad saying, I won this tshirt playing DB
(02:36:29)(stealth6)they did?
(02:36:39)(Locki)No Pay-2-Win and No-Charging-for-Maps Hybrid: 1) Totally free core game, no bullshit grind, for comp/tourny play with 5 classes/obj maps 2) Pay-What-You-Want packages in exchange for (not pay-2-win) awesome stuff, 3) Near full open release of game, buy balanced cool new complete additional characters - sound good?
(02:36:50)(cause|Rex)BF premium is just a greedy shit
(02:37:03)(INF3RN0)that sounds good to me
(02:37:08)(amazinglarry)I think that sounds pretty fair.
(02:37:11)(stealth6)not really, but they brainwashed you into buying it
(02:37:24)(stealth6)killed by "premium player"
(02:37:27)(cause|Rex)sounds good!
(02:37:29)(Pytox_)no mode with xp boost orsmth like that right
(02:37:29)(stealth6)+ ads everywhere
(02:37:31)(amazinglarry)I like the non pay for tourney action. I was expecting the opposite.
(02:37:33)(Pytox_)or level up mode
(02:37:41)(Pytox_)sort of like a starter pack
(02:37:56)(cause|Rex)ohh and you join faster if you got premium
(02:37:58)(Locki)That's better than selling scopes and weapon sights at 50c isn;'t it? :)
(02:38:06)(Sean)totez
(02:38:08)(Sean):P
(02:38:12)(INF3RN0)i hate having to save up for the essential bits
(02:38:16)(Pytox_)yes
(02:38:17)(cause|Rex)or for bullets! :D
(02:38:22)(Pytox_)for medics lolp
(02:38:23)(amazinglarry)Hahah imagine that
(02:38:24)(INF3RN0)but maybe one day ill cash in for some cool socks for my char
(02:38:24)(Locki)It is critical that tournament play is free.
(02:38:27)(Pytox_)30$ for a medic
(02:38:30)(SockDog)Locki: I'd like to buy stuff like... weapons and have them unlocked perminantly. Now if you wanted to say something like, all weapons released in 2013 for X pounds, that isn't so bad. It means 2014 I come back for more. Not all that happy about renting all weapons for a year and the losing them unless I pay.
(02:38:46)(Sean)SockDog, you want to pay to win?
(02:38:48)(Locki)Yes - that's what some of the packages might be
(02:38:58)(Pytox_)not like level up faster?
(02:38:59)(Locki)(but for characters not weapons)
(02:39:05)(cause|Rex)I think he wants...
(02:39:14)(stealth6)Pytox_ who said anything about levels :s
(02:39:17)(amazinglarry)Okay good, was making sure there's no weapon purchasing since that's p2w
(02:39:18)(Pytox_)ah :D
(02:39:38)(INF3RN0)as long as you run your pay items through test groups and have players tell you whether they are influencing their performance or not ;o
(02:39:39)(amazinglarry)weapon skins are perfectly okay, though. People like their golden guns in CoD :P
(02:39:41)(amazinglarry)May as well offer it.
(02:39:42)(SockDog)Sean: I'm saying I don't want to grind for different weapons or add ons or whatever. I'm happy paying SD but I want to pay for a full game not bit by bit or rent stuff.
(02:40:00)(Sean)Paul just said there won't be any grind.
(02:40:02)(Pytox_)or kill someone to grind a weapon
(02:40:15)(Pytox_)heh
(02:40:16)(cause|Rex)or rent
(02:40:16)(SockDog)Sean: I point you towards coins.
(02:40:28)(INF3RN0)an example of some of the biggest selling items in f2p games from my experience has been like gold weapon skins, hats, player models, etc
(02:40:35)(Pytox_)hats is the biggest
(02:40:36)(Locki)What we _could_ do, once we're full open and released, is let poor kids (which I was one of) earn free characters by playing more.
(02:40:39)(Pytox_)you forgot tshirts INF3RN0
(02:40:43)(Sean)hats
(02:40:43)(INF3RN0)hah ofc
(02:40:44)(Sean):D:D:D
(02:40:48)(INF3RN0)im not even kidding.
(02:40:50)(SockDog)Weapons was just an example, but there is a mechanic there to unlock through play. I'm just not interested in that.
(02:40:55)(amazinglarry)I'll buy some new 'vsays' ;)
(02:41:00)(INF3RN0)people spend more money on looks than function
(02:41:08)(Pytox_)yes just like in irl
(02:41:09)(stealth6)I'd just have a solid gold character... bling bling
(02:41:13)(INF3RN0)only the tournament crowd spent money on winning items
(02:41:24)(Locki)I don't mind things that are not gameplay affecting.
(02:41:32)(SockDog)Locki: You should make people buy and gift stuff to kids. :)
(02:41:34)(Pytox_)as long as it doesn't make gameplay hard
(02:41:39)(Sean)perhaps different voice packs for vsays
(02:41:40)(cause|Rex)no we don't want to spend our money on winning items
(02:41:40)(Pytox_)like hard to see someone or so
(02:41:44)(@Anti-)INF3RN0, that's not really true, gameplay affecting sells a lot better than appearance stuff, it's why so many companies do pay-2-win unfortunately
(02:42:01)(stealth6)SockDog a button to donate money and it's put towards a random item for a random player lol
(02:42:04)(Pytox_)would be cool that you could have a beard on the character
(02:42:07)(Pytox_)lol
(02:42:09)(@Anti-)folks like Riot and Valve are good to resist and keeps fans happy because of it
(02:42:12)(Sean)I'm going to be brutally honest, I don't think Splash Damage can afford a Pay2Win model.
(02:42:13)(INF3RN0)it's a matter of what game your talking about- some games actually do quite well on aesthetics
(02:42:15)(SockDog)stealth6: Why the hell not. Locki!
(02:42:17)(Donnovan)Carmack is starting to face his demos... He will born in his last breath... He cant understand couse its not a matter of human logic... they are just our lovely tools, like our lovely children draws.
(02:42:26)(Donnovan)Need to go.
(02:42:30)(amazinglarry)Well Anti, I'd argue it does better because people are effectively 'forced' to continue the buying treadmill to stay competitive.
(02:42:33)(Locki)Well lemme as - would you pay $5 or $10 for your favourite new character so far? If everything else was free?
(02:42:33)(@Anti-)Sean, I'm not sure anybody can in the long run
(02:42:57)(Sean)let me add an "especially" before Splash Damage then :P
(02:42:58)(Locki)cya donn
(02:42:58)(@Anti-)if you abuse your customers they eventually leave :)
(02:43:08)(SockDog)Locki: I'm happy paying SD, my dilema would be on what because there is some implied use.
(02:43:14)(amazinglarry)I'd spend 5 bucks on Engy 2 probably.
(02:43:29)(stealth6)How would I know it's my favorite character without having played it?
(02:43:33)(Pytox_)engy 2 is awesome
(02:43:39)(Sean)demo Kappa
(02:43:42)(cause|Rex)or they buy the next game Anti- XDDD
(02:43:44)(amazinglarry)steal6 have free rotating weeks like LoL :P
(02:43:46)(INF3RN0)Well tbh I find engy 2 to be much better than engy1
(02:43:51)(Pytox_)yes
(02:43:52)(cause|Rex)hopinh it gets better XD
(02:43:58)(Locki)you could play it first
(02:44:00)(murka^L2)smg over shotty anyday
(02:44:05)(amazinglarry)no doubt.
(02:44:11)(murka^L2)plus the turret is awesome
(02:44:18)(Pytox_)yes
(02:44:25)(murka^L2)bad placement = easy destroy
(02:44:26)(SockDog)I really don't like that single weapon load out stuff. Sometimes I like to switch shotty to smg during a match
(02:44:28)(cause|Rex)for a moviemod I pay 100 euros! :D
(02:44:31)(INF3RN0)its a tough decision for me
(02:44:36)(amazinglarry)Just don't have me spend 5 bucks on Engy 2 and then nerf the shit out of the turret.
(02:44:43)(murka^L2)locki did place turret nicely today, in the bush on london bridge
(02:44:47)(amazinglarry)I'll bring a cat to the pound.
(02:44:47)(INF3RN0)in a game like LoL i have access to everything i need already
(02:44:48)(Locki)ok - well what if there was always five core classes, and each two weeks we ALWAYS brought a brand new cool (and balance by VIPs) new character in to the game, and everyone got to play him for the next eight weeks, before he got cycled out?
(02:44:53)(murka^L2)so many just ran past and lost hp
(02:45:02)(Pytox_)i did that too murka^L2 it's an ambush :p
(02:45:22)(SockDog)LOL
(02:45:26)(SockDog)I see what you did there
(02:45:27)(amazinglarry)That would be interesting Locki if you think you could maintain that consistency.
(02:45:36)(Locki)yes - would that work?
(02:45:41)(INF3RN0)I am just wondering if its possible to implement a LoL system in FPS
(02:45:42)(amazinglarry)Big promise lol
(02:45:42)(Pytox_)hmm yea would it take long to balance?
(02:45:51)(SockDog)What would be different in the classes?
(02:45:51)(cause|Rex)testing it before sounds good anyway
(02:46:04)(Locki)oh - there's so much cool stuff we can do
(02:46:05)(Pytox_)like new weapons and so?
(02:46:13)(murka^L2)i would love to see a decoy
(02:46:16)(Pytox_)no rc cars right?
(02:46:17)(murka^L2)makes footstep sounds
(02:46:24)(Locki)Each new class would always be true to their role, but have unique weapons, abilities, and tools.
(02:46:40)(Pytox_)a class with a dancing ability?
(02:46:45)(amazinglarry)I think balancing eventually would be tough to maintain, though?
(02:46:47)(SockDog)But the core class would be consistent. You;ve have engire with pliers but instead of mines or turrets you'd have RC car/copter?
(02:46:48)(@Anti-)Pytox_, if we had one it would require a skill to use
(02:46:52)(@Anti-)RC car that is
(02:46:53)(cause|Rex)seems too difficult to do
(02:46:54)(Pytox_):)
(02:46:56)(@Anti-)not dancing :)
(02:47:06)(Locki)You would only need five sets in year one (assuming one each two weeks)
(02:47:10)(INF3RN0)As long as SD planned to run things through intensive balance testing before release. I think we could bring some good change to the world.
(02:47:42)(Locki)Yes - the Pay-What-You-Want guys would have a special pass to Test Realm servers, and could play EVERYTHING early.
(02:47:57)(Pytox_)would there be like a ufo invasion ability and things like that :D
(02:48:02)(INF3RN0)A founders club would be cool.
(02:48:14)(INF3RN0)or VIP or whatever
(02:48:15)(Pytox_)social club like rockstar :p
(02:48:17)(Locki)...and our Echo System gives us publishable objective data that proves if something is balanced or not.
(02:48:20)(SockDog)I'd probably want the tweaks to be pretty basic. Core classes function the same but have these little differences. Don't like the idea of picking a character that is going to be a shit engineer/medic or whatever because I want an awesome jelly making machine
(02:48:23)(amazinglarry)Yeah I like feeling special haha
(02:48:26)  quit: (Donnovan) (webchat@189-25-31-103.user.veloxzone.com.br) (Ping timeout)
(02:48:40)(Locki)yes, agreed
(02:48:45)(Locki)ok Founders Club - deal :)
(02:48:49)(amazinglarry)v57
(02:48:55)(Locki)with game credits for all of you!
(02:48:56)(@Anti-)SockDog, internally we've already defined 'roles' per class, guys would always have to fill this role
(02:48:57)(Pytox_)SD sluts it's where it's at
(02:49:01)(Pytox_)lol
(02:49:06)(@Anti-)just different ways to do it for different guys
(02:49:12)(SockDog)Anti-: <3
(02:49:12)(Pytox_)that's what the steam communtiy is called at least
(02:49:44)(Sean)(00:47:26) (Locki) Yes - the Pay-What-You-Want guys would have a special pass to Test Realm servers, and could play EVERYTHING early.
(02:49:58)(Sean)how strict would the NDAs be for those test realm servers?
(02:50:03)(Sean)non-existant?
(02:50:04)(SockDog)We need gold gloves. :)
(02:50:10)(Pytox_)a pink sword
(02:50:29)(SockDog)and a smooth headband made of shimmering goat funk
(02:50:34)(Pytox_)everyone would buy a katana if it were in a class :D
(02:51:00)(@Anti-)Pytox_, you have some ....interesting...suggestions sometimes :D
(02:51:11)(Pytox_)yes i have made some here too in the past http://www.moddb.com/mods/gangs4life/images/rip-gangs4life
(02:51:12)(Pytox_):p
(02:51:17)(Locki)I just like to trust people
(02:51:21)(stealth6)bolt action sniper rifle - nuff said
(02:51:27)(Locki)12 years, and we never had a leak yet
(02:51:36)(amazinglarry)Is there any wood around?
(02:51:43)(@Anti-)hehe
(02:51:50)(@Anti-)that's not a challenge :P
(02:51:54)(Locki)I'm going to test it soon anyway - we're planning to give you another map that has NO art to try the gameplay
(02:51:57)(SockDog)I've got wood
(02:51:59)(Sean)but Locki, what if I was somebody who had no life (lol at the what if bit) and just wanted to damage the Splash Damage reputation and didn't mind paying for the special pass
(02:52:06)(Locki)I'd love you guys to be able to playtest maps before we finalise the layout for art
(02:52:07)(amazinglarry)Knock on SockDog's wood!
(02:52:17)(Pytox_):D
(02:52:24) SockDog fizzles
(02:52:27)(Locki)Sean - they would have signed an NDA
(02:52:38)(Sean)signing is one thing, sticking to it is another
(02:52:55)(INF3RN0)I hope the maps become less confined.
(02:53:00)(@mitsuhiko).oO( and have you seen splash damange's laywers? that's how good they are )
(02:53:00)(Locki)Maybe we could make it invited.
(02:53:01)(INF3RN0)I like at least 3+ path ways at all times
(02:53:02)(amazinglarry)Breaking an NDA means a covy steals their pants.
(02:53:06)(Sean)I think invited is best
(02:53:15)(Locki)LOL London Bridge has NINE pathways at all times :)
(02:53:17)(Pytox_)i wonder if there will be a beach map soon too :)
(02:53:25)(INF3RN0)LB is the best map so far
(02:53:39)(Locki)Breaking NDA means the 1v2 against Dom and Inf3rno
(02:53:39)(INF3RN0)I think the other 2 lack in some areas when I compare it to the standard set by LB
(02:53:39)(Sean)I wouldn't like to think that anybody can access the secret areas of the game, and potentially ruin the opportunity of new things being received well
(02:53:40)(SockDog)I hope we see something in a park
(02:53:40)(stealth6)LB best map??? omg times have changed
(02:53:41)(INF3RN0):p
(02:53:45)(@Anti-)to be honest, S2, Valve and Blizzard have all run good public test realms, it is doable
(02:53:50)(Sean):P
(02:54:08)(Locki)I used to play oin UO's test realm
(02:54:22)(amazinglarry)Yeah even Turbine for LOTRO and DDO have test environments that are well managed.
(02:54:23)(@Anti-)the power and wisdom of crowds generally reduces the influence of idiots :)
(02:54:24)(SockDog)I think you just have to manage any leaks, if they happen. Some people are dicks.
(02:54:30)(amazinglarry)In that I don't think it's really too policed.
(02:54:43)(Locki)I better get some sleep - I started work at 4am this morning, and it's 1am now, so that's 21 hours straight.
(02:54:51)(Pytox_);o
(02:54:55)(SockDog)nn. Again.
(02:54:59)(amazinglarry)I really think that once the game is officially out, public test servers won't really need any nda's etc.
(02:55:03)(Pytox_)me too it's 2am :p
(02:55:04)(@Anti-)SockDog, depends on the type of content, those companies just announce what is coming before it goes to test
(02:55:04)(amazinglarry)They're basically 'preview' servers.
(02:55:07)(SockDog)That Locki is so damanding. :)
(02:55:16)(SockDog)was that a word. :)
(02:55:26)(Locki)I have LOVED talking to you guys about this. I really think this hybrid model could have legs, and its far less gittish/more ethical than all the crap people normally do.
(02:55:30)(amazinglarry)Good times, I appreciate the chat! Very excited with the direction you're headin.
(02:55:53)(Locki)thanks guys - looking forward to playing this weekend
(02:55:54)(Locki)cya all!
(02:55:56)(Pytox_)ok :)
(02:55:56)(Pytox_)cya
(02:55:59)(stealth6)bye
(02:55:59)(INF3RN0)cya
(02:56:02)(murka^L2)bb
(02:56:04)(amazinglarry)auf widersehen
(02:56:05)(Sean)gn Locki, thanks for tonight
(02:56:07)(murka^L2)v55
(02:56:07)  nick: (Locki) is now known as (Locki|away)
(02:56:10)(Sean)great words
(02:56:11)(Pytox_)what if you sell legs in the game lol
(02:56:13)(cause|Rex)we also really appreciate talking to you ;)
(02:56:33)(@Anti-)oh Pytox_ :)
(02:56:44)(@Anti-)you're my new favourite I think
(02:56:47)(Pytox_):D
(02:56:48)(SockDog)Anti-: I feel, truely honoured to be included in this, not just to play a game but to be involved in it's development, probably the closest I'll ever come to making a game. As such I'd take your NDA to my grave, so much so that I think I've freaked out a collegue by asking for his email but not explaining why,
(02:57:00)(@Anti-)before it was INF3RN0, because he owns me in matches :(
(02:57:11)(INF3RN0)I will make you hate the name.
(02:57:14)(INF3RN0)>:D
(02:57:14)(Pytox_)i'm more objective driven :D
(02:57:20)(Pytox_)i'm not about the kills :p
(02:57:26)(stealth6)lol SockDog
(02:57:27)(murka^L2)damnit, i could own too if i had more frames
(02:57:34)(SockDog)Seriously though, co-op horde mode.
(02:57:35)(stealth6)awkward conversation.
(02:57:50)(@Anti-)SockDog, this is the better bit of development to be involved in :)
(02:58:00)(stealth6)I have 30fps most of the time and I do alright (I think)
(02:58:02)(INF3RN0)I also think DB is gonna benefit from more unique game modes'
(02:58:03)(@Anti-)if you join the actual team you need to start doing work!!
(02:58:06)(Pytox_)me 60fps on medium
(02:58:12)(SockDog)Yes, I get to bitch and play games. That's all you guys do isn't it. :)
(02:58:13)(murka^L2)well i do also, 50kills a map and whatnot
(02:58:18)(INF3RN0)every f2p game has identical modes, but none have objs in the mix
(02:58:27)(Pytox_)and levels
(02:58:30)(murka^L2)can't wait till next month when i get enough money for new cpu mobo and ram
(02:58:35)(murka^L2)then i will rape
(02:58:45)(stealth6)lol
(02:58:47)(Pytox_):D
(02:58:54)(SockDog)stealth6: No shit, I was like, what's your email and do you mind me posting it to a semi public forum..... No I'm not drunk, on drugs or wanting to do anything illegal with it. Oh you'
(02:59:01)(SockDog)'re going to bed.
(02:59:06)(Pytox_)me too 2am here :p
(02:59:16)(INF3RN0)im going back to class soon here xD
(02:59:23)(INF3RN0)only NA alive in DB
(02:59:36)(murka^L2)euros are sleeping
(02:59:38)(Pytox_)nn
(02:59:38)(murka^L2)oh wait
(02:59:39)(Pytox_)i'm euro
(02:59:40)(Pytox_):p
(02:59:41)(Sean)yeah right
(02:59:43)(INF3RN0)haha
(02:59:43)(stealth6)I'm just sitting here like where did my evening go...
(02:59:44)(@Anti-)I want to go to bed, but had to stay awake for this
(02:59:44)(Sean)Euro here too
(02:59:47)(Sean)Euros never sleep
(02:59:49)(Sean)INF3RN0 knows this
(02:59:57)(SockDog)Anti-: My work is boring as hell. Today I got a box from Germany to Sweden. HUrrah! :)
(02:59:57)(INF3RN0)lol
(02:59:59)(@Anti-)Locki will probably have me start building all the stuff you suggested tomorrow :D
(03:00:08)(SockDog)ROTFL
(03:00:17)(INF3RN0)Ill never see you in game again :x
(03:00:18)(Pytox_)=)
(03:00:22)(SockDog)You've been Molyneuxed
(03:00:26)(@Anti-)it's bee nice knowing you ;P
(03:00:29)(Pytox_)molydeuxed
(03:00:31)(@Anti-)been*
(03:00:31)(Pytox_)heh
(03:00:36)(murka^L2)now back to the cave where you belong
(03:00:56)(@mitsuhiko)Anti-: i updated my backlog
(03:01:09)(@Anti-)haha
(03:01:19)(murka^L2)oh dear, i just realized i have to get up in 3hrs
(03:01:26)(@Anti-)because you're not busy already :P
(03:01:43)(@mitsuhiko)i don't know what you're talking about :)
(03:01:48)(SockDog)Just do a google and beta for 5 years
(03:02:04)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: that's so web 2.0, the world has moved on
(03:02:13)(@Anti-)if only we had Google's money-hats :)
(03:02:33)(Sean)Anti-, let me ask you something. Is this more fun than ET:QW because you guys aren't being pushed by Activision & id?
(03:02:36)(Pytox_)make billboards with google adwords and youtube videos showing on it!
(03:02:39)(Pytox_)lol
(03:03:25)(stealth6)Loose 10 kilos in 2 weeks - looks down at ripped character...
(03:04:12)(stealth6)adwords and leftclick to open in browser
(03:04:12)(SockDog)mitsuhiko: You can't have enough mirrored icons.
(03:04:21)(murka^L2)oh i just lost my legs, that's more than 10kg
(03:04:43)(stealth6)next ad: purchase legs 5$
(03:04:48)(Pytox_):p
(03:04:49)(@Anti-)I can't really answer that fairly Sean as I do different work now to what I did then
(03:04:54)(SockDog)Really wouldn't mind ads as long as SD had the option to modify them to fit.
(03:05:01)(Sean)ah ok
(03:05:12)(@mitsuhiko)what he means is that he now can't blame other people :)
(03:05:17)(Sean)but I guess it's more exciting for the company to work on this title compared to ET:QW
(03:05:20)(SockDog)And they atually made SD serious money
(03:05:20)(@Anti-)personally I was never in a position to feel push by iD or ATVI
(03:05:22)(Sean)you guys have the reigns, right?
(03:05:29)(@Anti-)and I like the game anyway :)
(03:05:36)(Sean)ET:QW > *
(03:05:40)(Sean)really miss it :(
(03:05:42)(Pytox_)you forgot to add zenimax :p
(03:05:43)(@Anti-)'we' have the reigns yes :)
(03:05:55)(Sean)changed my life! :')
(03:06:00)(SockDog)LOL Anti- isn't pushed. Did you just see what Locki did?
(03:06:05)(@Anti-)but again, I'm not top of the chain, so people can always tell me to do stuff :D
(03:06:20)(@Anti-)but that is what it's about being in a team in a creative industry
(03:06:39)(@Anti-)everybody has very strong personal opinions and ideas about what is best
(03:06:49)(@Anti-)we cant all do all of our ideas all the time
(03:06:57)(@Anti-)so somebody has to direct
(03:07:07)(Sean)Anti- in the office today; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZLVi4v7lSM
(03:07:10)(SockDog)BTW - Noob Question - Who's nosebone?
(03:07:16)(Pytox_)president
(03:07:32)(@Anti-)publishers like ATVI dont make bad decisions, they just make different ones for different reasons
(03:07:49)(Pytox_)they make it more money grabbing decisions ;p
(03:07:50)(@Anti-)in the case of DB it's nice that our reasons are ones we all agree with on the team
(03:08:02)(Pytox_)for their part
(03:08:06)(cause|Rex);) nice
(03:08:27)(SockDog)Pytox_: I saw that but name?
(03:08:33)(@Anti-)SockDog, I forget his exact title but he's Creative/Art Director
(03:08:37)(Pytox_)idk SockDog :D
(03:08:39)(SockDog)I need to update my SD stalkerfile
(03:08:42) @Anti- is probably getting sacked in the morning
(03:08:44)(@Anti-):D
(03:08:50)(Pytox_)isn't that RosOne's job :p
(03:09:08)(stealth6)my stalkerfile is years behind
(03:09:30)(stealth6)having to brush up on who everybody is since the start of this pre alpha business
(03:09:52)(stealth6)and by brush up I mean knife in game
(03:09:53)(Pytox_)and wouldn't it be possible to be like ns2
(03:09:55)(SockDog)SD needs to use G+ more, I hardly stalk on twitter now
(03:10:01)(Pytox_)to like sell the game on steam without any f2p stuff
(03:10:17)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: twitter > g+
(03:10:24)(@Anti-)indeed
(03:10:34)(Pytox_)ns2 sold quite a lot on steam
(03:10:39)(@Anti-)Horse Ebooks isn't on G+ :)
(03:10:40)(Pytox_)wasn't it over a million?
(03:10:40)(stealth6)what is G+?
(03:10:45)(Pytox_)g+ meh
(03:10:48)(SockDog)Fuck DB /me drops mike.
(03:10:48)(cause|Rex)who got ns2 here?
(03:10:52)(stealth6)jk
(03:10:56)(SockDog)Don't dis G+
(03:11:03)(Pytox_)i've got ns2
(03:11:07)(@mitsuhiko)Pytox_: > 1 million for ns2? i call bullshit
(03:11:15)(Pytox_)let me search :D
(03:11:37)(Sean)who here is on Twitter?
(03:11:37)(SockDog)Maybe I just need to cut down my noise on twitter.
(03:11:39)(Pytox_)1m $
(03:11:43)(Pytox_)http://www.vg247.com/2012/11/08/natural-selection-2-earns-over-1-million-during-launch-week/
(03:11:55)(@mitsuhiko)ah, i thought sold copies
(03:12:01)(Pytox_)no :D
(03:12:05)(cause|Rex)I just follow SD and Paul :P
(03:12:06)(SockDog)G+ is nice for posts though, just not many people actively post on there.
(03:12:17)(Pytox_)i still have claptrap image on g+
(03:12:29)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: chicken egg. i have enough people that would follow me on g+ but barely anyone writes
(03:12:30)(SockDog)Sean: Me, but I tend to G+ more now
(03:12:31)(@mitsuhiko)so i never write there
(03:12:34)(cause|Rex)but since we got invited in to the alpha I don't need twitter anymore
(03:12:36)(Sean)I never got into G+
(03:12:50)(SockDog)mitsuhiko: But you can write more.
(03:12:51)(@mitsuhiko)i basically just click the red icon away
(03:12:57)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: but i can also just tweet :)
(03:13:00)(SockDog)Oh that hurts! :)
(03:13:06)(SockDog)G+ name
(03:13:21)(Pytox_)SockDog: do you have me on your stalker list?
(03:13:25)(SockDog)I'm going to comment on everything and spam you with pictures of my dogs
(03:13:26)(Pytox_)with g+ and such :D
(03:13:27)(@mitsuhiko)also i guess g+ is full of spammers. i have 70% my twitter follower count on g+ with basically zero activity
(03:13:33)(Sean)I hope this guy gets sacked and deletes his Twitter in rage so I can steal his name https://twitter.com/sean
(03:13:44)(Pytox_)pytox was taken too on twitter
(03:13:58)(SockDog)G+ and Twitter names pls
(03:13:59)(Sean)I'm fine with having @Seanza as my username, though
(03:14:03)(stealth6)You should demand he gives it to you
(03:14:07)(@mitsuhiko)thsi still bothers me: https://twitter.com/armin
(03:14:26)(stealth6)that picture would bother me too
(03:14:28)(Sean)this bothers me https://twitter.com/adroits
(03:14:32)(Pytox_)SockDog: https://plus.google.com/112393049771803793913/posts
(03:14:34)(Pytox_):D
(03:14:40)(Sean)spam account using a username I'd love for my company :(
(03:14:45)(Sean)stuck with @adroitstweets -,-
(03:15:06)(SockDog)https://twitter.com/SockDog https://plus.google.com/u/0/102068470187765866318/about
(03:15:33)(@mitsuhiko)followed. you never know :)
(03:15:44)(Pytox_)me too
(03:15:59)(@mitsuhiko)it recommended me to follow rahdo
(03:16:05)(Pytox_)is rahdo still at sd?
(03:16:11)(SockDog)nope
(03:16:21)(Sean)Rahdo is the most hated man in the world right now
(03:16:24)(Sean)well, a year ago
(03:16:25)(Pytox_):D
(03:16:29)(SockDog)he evaded the police in Malta last I heard. :)
(03:16:38)(Pytox_)o_O
(03:16:44)(@mitsuhiko):D
(03:16:49)(cause|Rex)has he been sacked? :D
(03:16:56)(@Anti-)he's a very cool guy actually
(03:17:04)(SockDog)I think he did his job
(03:17:04)(@Anti-)no, he retired
(03:17:09)(Sean)he was the HiRezBart of Splash Damage
(03:17:10)(cause|Rex)but that wasn't nice what he did to us...
(03:17:16)(Sean)the FourZeroTwo of Splash Damage
(03:17:21)(@Anti-)that's not reall fair Sean
(03:17:28)(@Anti-)same as BArt isn't that bad
(03:17:29)(SockDog)Probably bad circumstances to judge someone
(03:17:34)(Sean):P
(03:17:39)(Sean)I know, I like Bart actually
(03:17:52)(Sean)but he does say a lot of things that don't happen ;P
(03:17:56)(Sean)without disclaimer!
(03:18:05)(@Anti-)Rahdo was an awesome guy to work with, and is an amazing designer, but he just isn't so much an FPS player
(03:18:08)(Sean)badman > any other community manager!
(03:18:20)(Pytox_)i'm going lol it's too late now :
(03:18:21)(Pytox_):p
(03:18:27)(Pytox_)nn
(03:18:30)(Sean)gn
(03:18:30)(SockDog)Badman just doesn't give a fuck. He's so German.
(03:18:35)(@Anti-)lol
(03:18:41)(SockDog)nn Pytickle
(03:18:52)(Sean)it's not hassle for Hessel
(03:18:54)(cause|Rex)that's a yellow for you!
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(03:19:17)(stealth6)Random question: why does twitter exist (what do they sell)?
(03:19:28)(Sean)twitter is amazing
(03:19:32)(@Anti-)data
(03:19:34)(SockDog)I work with Germans all day. It's like, "no, it's like this, now shut up"
(03:19:37)(@Anti-)and they do some ads now
(03:19:45)(stealth6)just what people say?
(03:19:55)(Sean)need to be special to advertise on twitter
(03:19:58)(Sean)sucks :(
(03:20:11)(@Anti-)they get GPS data, comments, trends etc
(03:20:27)(@Anti-)a lot of it can be combined with other data to find out info that might help your business
(03:20:29)(SockDog)G+ is honestly so much better than twitter
(03:20:38)(stealth6)interesting
(03:20:39)(Sean)different things, SockDog
(03:20:49)(Sean)apples and oranges
(03:21:09)(SockDog)Nah G+ has the openness of twitter but the discussion level stuff of facebook
(03:21:20)(SockDog)It's a nice marriage
(03:21:22)(Sean)it doesn't have the audience of Twitter, though
(03:21:38)(SockDog)Ahh but audience is just where the herd is grazing
(03:21:45)(SockDog)we need cattle prods
(03:21:55)(SockDog)and dynamite
(03:22:03)(SockDog)LOTS OF DYNAMITE
(03:22:04)(Sean)the herd graze on the best patch
(03:22:07)(@Anti-)ok, time for sleeps
(03:22:07)(SockDog)Mooohaahhahahaaa
(03:22:10)(Sean)gn Anti-
(03:22:14)(@Anti-)laters
(03:22:16)(SockDog)nn Anti-
(03:22:17)(Sean)thanks for your time today man :)
(03:22:20)(Sean)was good discussions tonight
(03:22:29)(SockDog)Best Alpha day ever
(03:22:30)(@Anti-)you'll be fed up of me in no time :P
(03:22:31)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: you pay for twitter's firehose
(03:22:46)(Sean);)
(03:22:47)(@mitsuhiko)which is a system where you can connect to which gives you all the tweets as they happen
(03:22:51)  quit: (Anti-) (Anti-@host81-151-149-22.range81-151.btcentralplus.com) (Signed off)
(03:22:58)(Sean)that too
(03:23:05)(stealth6)cool
(03:23:07)(Sean)I love me some Tweetdeck open all day on its own screen
(03:23:27)(stealth6)It's pretty cool what you can learn from social media
(03:23:33)(Sean)definitely
(03:24:08)(@mitsuhiko)s/social media/human beings/
(03:24:21)(stealth6)I did my internship at a university with a bunch of guys doing doctorates and while I was there they were working on displaying statistics about info grabbed from flickr, facebook and the like
(03:24:53)(SockDog)I tend to just scroll groups on twitter.
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(03:25:25)(SockDog)At one time it was a huge timesink, I mean checking every fecking post going back since I last checked.
(03:25:48)(@mitsuhiko)holy shit. did this just happen: https://rt.com/news/un-palestinians-non-member-832/
(03:25:52)(@mitsuhiko)sorry for ot
(03:26:06)(SockDog)Eventually I relented and sorted people by topic so my gaming list is usually top read then Top Follows. Rarely do I get further than that
(03:26:30)(@mitsuhiko)SockDog: what i learned from 5 years of twitter is just having a healty balance of complaining and praising people
(03:26:40)(@mitsuhiko)just head for the extremes
(03:26:45)(Sean)mitsuhiko "The Israeli government has described Abbass speech,"
(03:26:51)(Sean)bad grammar turns me off
(03:26:53)(SockDog)This is why I follow SD. :)
(03:27:13)(INF3RN0)grammarcrackers
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(03:29:20)(SockDog)Right, bed for me. It's not so much that it's late but more so that the litre of vodka bought for Friday night is now half a litre.
(03:29:32)(SockDog)Fuck Friday work I guess. :)
(03:29:35)(Sean)gn SockDog
(03:29:50)(SockDog)NN ma bitches. :)
(03:30:00)(Sean)mitsuhiko, just seen your reply in that Login name vs. Nickname thread after I posted
(03:30:09)(Sean)Unique ID will solve that problem!!!
(03:30:15)(@mitsuhiko)Sean: we have unique ids
(03:30:24)(@mitsuhiko)but they are unique in the whole universe
(03:30:29)(@mitsuhiko)by which i mean that they are rather long
(03:31:13)(Sean)no way to make something like DBUID0123456789, then somebody can enter 0123456789 as the unique ID search to report a player
(03:31:34)(@mitsuhiko)Sean: internal id's are in this format: 7ee3163f-8edc-42a8-9baf-f4ee83992654
(03:31:34)(Sean)it works, PB GUIDs etc. etc.
(03:31:37)(@mitsuhiko)which is rather long :)
(03:31:41)(Sean)for sure
(03:31:45)(@mitsuhiko)and does not show up on scoreboards
(03:31:51)(@mitsuhiko)so if you see them on youtube you won't have much of a chance
(03:32:13)(@mitsuhiko)that was btw just mean as some food for thoughts
(03:32:37)(stealth6)who reports players anyway?
(03:33:15)(Sean)I think it's important to be able to have that internal ID relate to an external ID
(03:33:17)(@mitsuhiko)i don't see us charging for nickname changes i think
(03:33:19)(stealth6)I always assumed reporting is a waste of time, the reports just en up in /dev/null
(03:33:24)(Sean)Blizzard do :P
(03:33:26)(@mitsuhiko)but then again, i'm not in charge when it comes to that stuff
(03:33:27)(Sean)they allow 1 for free
(03:33:47)(Sean)or like in ET:QW, 3 accounts per CD key
(03:33:58)(stealth6)and I don't see how it stops you from reporting anyway
(03:34:10)(stealth6)you just click report button and in the background it grabs his ID
(03:34:19)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: well, once you have changeable nicknames you can't report by nickname from stuff outside the game
(03:34:21)(cause|Rex)ohh we got the first flamers in the forum :>
(03:34:26)(@mitsuhiko)if you are in a game with a hacker you can always report properly
(03:34:33)(@mitsuhiko)cause|Rex: where? i want to torch him
(03:34:38)(stealth6)what kind of stuff outside the game?
(03:34:51)(cause|Rex)http://forums.warchestgames.com/showthread.php/33355-Beta-Testers?p=411049&viewfull=1#post411049
(03:34:52)(stealth6)Db is going to be more than a game?
(03:35:27)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: think of videos on youtube for instance
(03:35:29)(stealth6)cause|Rex troll detected
(03:35:37)(cause|Rex)where?
(03:35:38)(Sean)mitsuhiko, that's a minority situation imo
(03:35:42)(stealth6)that post
(03:35:49)(Sean)most reporting will be done in-game
(03:35:49)(cause|Rex)not in this thread
(03:35:50)(@mitsuhiko)Sean: it might very well be a strawman
(03:36:38)(cause|Rex)http://forums.warchestgames.com/showthread.php/33348-Questions-answers(hopefully)?p=411052&viewfull=1#post411052
(03:36:54)(Sean)I'm just concerned that the standpoint on this is "It stops people from reporting cheaters if they see them on YouTube or other external game media"
(03:36:56)(stealth6)what sean said, I don't think you should allow to report a player you've never played with
(03:36:58)(cause|Rex)glad the com fought back :P
(03:37:11)(stealth6)abusable
(03:37:23)(Sean)I love being able to type /name then whatever I want into a console
(03:37:38)(Sean)and, it allows teams/players to market their sponsors in-game too
(03:37:38)(@mitsuhiko)Sean: there is no standpoint at the moment within sd/ft/wc as far as i know
(03:37:53)(Sean)good to know
(03:38:09)(@mitsuhiko)our account system was designed with the idea in mind to give people separate display names from account names but we don't know yet if it's a good idea
(03:38:39)(stealth6)well I'm here to tell you it is
(03:38:39)(@mitsuhiko)Sean: in any case you will be able to set nickname prefixes (sponsor, clantag etc.)
(03:38:54)(Sean)yeah, but sometimes there is a character limit
(03:38:59)(@mitsuhiko)Sean: wip :)
(03:39:13)(Sean)in CS:GO teams are doing their clantag | playername | sponsor
(03:39:21)(Sean)there are prefixes and suffixes, and that's bloody cool!
(03:39:43)(stealth6)If you don't include it I'm not going to be a bitch about it, but I just don't understand why games don't do it anymore... always my name has to be stealth6 or stealth6666 or stealthsix
(03:39:57)(cause|Rex):P
(03:39:59)(Sean)aye, it's not a deal breaker for me either
(03:40:03)(Sean)just love the freedom
(03:40:22)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: the biggest reason is customer support
(03:40:35)(murka^L2)fun when you and friends put some theme names and stroll around
(03:40:38)(@mitsuhiko)(oh that guy is called penis and infringes my feelings)
(03:40:58)(Sean)I guess so
(03:41:13)(@mitsuhiko)if the name is set on the platform level there is a backlog and you know about it
(03:41:24)(@mitsuhiko)(also the reason for general stable nicknames is things like friendlists)
(03:41:40)(@mitsuhiko)in steam it got annoying enough that people can change their names so you can add a forced nickname to your friends now
(03:41:47)(Sean)could do it like Blizzard, battle.net ID
(03:41:50)(Sean):P
(03:42:05)(stealth6)ugh, global policing
(03:42:09)(@mitsuhiko)which i actively use because i have some university buddies left that decide it's a good idea to call themselves "somethign whitty about dota2 items"
(03:42:36)(@mitsuhiko)stealth6: my point is: there are reasons for everything, people don't just do stuff to piss other people off
(03:42:51)(@mitsuhiko)at which point it makes sense to discuss stuff :)
(03:43:05)(stealth6)yes I understand it's just annoying :D
(03:43:10)(stealth6)for me at aleast
(03:43:12)(Sean)today has been my favourite day so far since becoming involved with this Alpha
(03:43:42)(@mitsuhiko)alright. i'm off for today now or i won't be in the office at a reasonable time :)
(03:43:52)(Sean)gn mitsuhiko, thanks for your time today as well :)
(03:43:56)(stealth6)indeed
(03:43:58)(stealth6)nn
(03:44:15)(cause|Rex)thx and good night!
(03:44:18)(@mitsuhiko)gn8 all
(03:46:50)(cause|Rex)glad I also found some map bugs now
(03:47:04)(stealth6)Found a new one earlier
(03:47:13)(cause|Rex)felt like doing nothing for SD :(
(03:47:26)(stealth6)on waterloo you can jump over the wall @ spawn
(03:47:40)(cause|Rex)nice already reported?
(03:47:51)(stealth6)nope
(03:47:57)(stealth6)too lazy
(03:48:09)(stealth6)I was only going to play for an hour @ 21:30
(03:48:12)(stealth6)still here...
(03:48:39)(Sean)oh my godddddd
(03:48:40)(stealth6)and now it's like - I should go to bed, but I might miss something
(03:48:45)(Sean)getting "Could not get account" info :(
(03:48:51)(Sean)when trying to log in
(03:49:26)(stealth6)seriously had to work on a project for Flash, didn't get shit done... DB!!!!!!!! curse yoooooo
(03:51:19)(cause|Rex)are there 3 threads now about whitechapel bugs?
(03:51:26)(stealth6)probably
(03:51:38)(cause|Rex)k so it doesn't matter where I posted :P
(03:51:48)(stealth6)POST IT IN MINEEE
(03:51:49)(Sean)if you are not playing, please load your launcher to seed the update for me :D
(03:52:01)(stealth6)it's open, but no peers
(03:52:13)(Sean)ugh
(03:52:14)(Sean)more than a day remaining
(03:52:18)(cause|Rex)too late :(
(03:52:21)(Sean)picked a terrible time to update :D
(03:52:27)(cause|Rex)next time stealth6 ;)
(03:52:53)(stealth6)lol another thread about grenade launcher
(03:52:57)(cause|Rex)I seed amazing 160 Bytes!
(03:53:02)(stealth6)people should start reading other threads
(03:53:13)(cause|Rex)or use ctrl + F
(03:53:21)(stealth6)160 bytes! horry shit
(03:53:23)(Sean)ah nice one, speed is increasing thxxxx
(03:53:38)(stealth6)also seeding now
(03:53:40)(Sean)suddenly 5 seeds and peers
(03:53:44)(cause|Rex)also we don't need a topic for each movement issue...
(03:53:52)(cause|Rex)another thread popped up
(03:54:05)(stealth6)oh somethings going weird
(03:54:16)(stealth6)connections shutting down again
(03:55:11)(cause|Rex)strange this chan doesn't log
(03:55:11)(cause|Rex)although I got loggin ON